S2 EPISODE 11 THREAD 18-JAN-06: The Hunting Party

[Brian]

This is the discussion thread for the next LOST episode, "The Hunting Party"

Please post all your episode comments, mini-reviews, as well as simple questions ("What did so-and-so say?" "What did so-and-so see?" "What song played at this scene?") regarding the episode.

Any new theories or big issues raised by the episode may be started on a new thread.

Enjoy the episode!

Unlocking but please keep all countdowns, etc in the "Hype" thread. Thanks.

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Episode Description:

Jack, Locke and Sawyer pursue a determined Michael after he heads into the jungle toward the dreaded "Others" in search of Walt. Meanwhile, Sun has a surprising reaction to Jin's desire to join the search party, and Hurley and Charlie commiserate over the age-old conundrum of "what women want."

[imaguestage]

Michael says he has to do it alone. Hmmm...perhaps this is something Walt told him in the mystery message

[lawn_boy]

THE BUTTON WON'T GET PRESSED! :Cowdance:

[lawn_boy]

Just kidding, they're here... damn.

[lawn_boy]

Here's a speculation:

Why is it that Jack's life just happens to be filled to the BRIM with gorgeous women? Could Dharma be involved? Is it the monster manifesting itself as an Italian sex goddess?

Discuss.

[Mysterious Mike]

Michael has the sickness thread looking pretty good at this point.

[imaguestage]

The scene between Jack and Sarah talking about the pregnancy scare got me to thinking. All this talk of Jack's miracle surgery, what if Sarah has problems conceving as a result of the "miracle" surgery? This inability to have children could possibly lead to a divorce or seperation...

[Zelou]

humm itlian girls ! the best !
Forza italia
I don't think she is the monster :D
Yeah Michael said I have to go alone can't wait to see the message he had from walt. Why did he had to go alone but he have to bring guns with him too, can't figure out what's that about

[Mysterious Mike]

It did seem that there was part of the message we didn't see.

[imaguestage]

I respect that Jin wants to go help his friend, but I also respect that Sun wants to keep her husband safe. God, I just love those two:love2:

[Zelou]

It did seem that there was part of the message we didn't see.
I would say it's 100%

[Mysterious Mike]

Capt Gorton I presume



SQUEEEEEEEEEEEE

[Zelou]

OMG !
I LOVE THIS SHOW
is it the pirate ?
so michael is with walt?!!
OMG this was so freaky i gotta go hold the bong for a while!

[Lostnascarfan]

Capt.says"Fish-n-chips 4 all!!":bump:

[lawn_boy]

BEST

SHOW

EVER

[vegasidol]

Of course we meet the others in the dark...gotta love silhouettes.

[minnesotaadvocate]

The eyes didn't seem to match the rest of the face.
For a minute, I thought it was a woman. Crazy, huh?
(Must be my crappy tv.)

ETA: A woman in disguise, that is.
(To clarify my statement above.)

[DontFindMe]

Captain's silhouette reminds me of movie images of Moses!

[Zelou]

Yes Yes YEs YEs let's make a fire and TALK !

[lawn_boy]

Yes Yes YEs YEs let's make a fire and TALK !

Haha, yeah. Everybody STOP right now. Talk to the guy. Put the GUNS. DOWN.

[Canadianchick]

OMG this is WICKED!!! :clap:

He knows all their names.. how

[HIMEWAD]

obviously the guy from the boat, right?

this guy seems pretty put-together, physically and mentally (as opposed to Rouseau). There's no way that he's fending for himself as an outsider.

[Fru Mans Daughter]

I think its his dad! cause why else would they focus on him in the flashbacks. and they never found his body...

[Sylly]

S...Santa? Is that you? No wonder all the polar bears!

I gotta say... the italian woman... wow.

[lawn_boy]

Yes Yes YEs YEs let's make a fire and TALK !

DID YOU READ THE SCRIPT

[HIMEWAD]

um ... his dad's dead. it's not his dad. sheesh.

[joker9989]

What do you think of Hugo's chances with Libby?

[lawn_boy]

BRING HER OUT ALEX.......ROUSEAU

[DontFindMe]

Wonder why they want all the weapons?

[imaguestage]

I am now totally accepting of the theory that the Captn's group and the Ethan/Goodwin Others group are two seperate groups. Michael heads North (cause Walt told him to) while "the Others" attack the tailies in the East. Plus, the Capt'n was a little hesitant when Jack mentioned Ethan.

[joker9989]

"You and me aint done Zeke."

Hehe.

[vegasidol]

ZEKE?

[Mysterious Mike]

Zeke's , as Sawyer called him , gun was a Luger a german pistol.

[sculpey]

How the hell did you know he'd say, "let's make a fire and talk?" I need a hit off your bong !!

[CHFDigital]

I was absolutely transfixed by this last sequence. In terms of the torches, was anyone able to make out any shapes (ie. are we sure the other Others held them)?

[MrStaticVoid]

This is the first time since the hatch was first discovered that I feel so intrigued.

[Pieces of Arzt]

What does Zeke mean, and did anyone see Alex?

[iamaflashback]

how did he know everything they did in the hatch

[joker9989]

Nahh, I think the torches were lit too quick to be one person = one torch. I think it might have been something else at play.

[HIMEWAD]

it sure didn't look to me like there were a ton of people around them. just a lot of gas torches. i think Jack was right that the three of them really DID outnumber the others.

[Fru Mans Daughter]

okay im proven wrong....but anyway that was mighty interesting wasn't it??? if only kate haddened gone...anyway I think its really stupid that there "letting them live there" like it was there choice!

[Pieces of Arzt]

it sure didn't look to me like there were a ton of people around them. just a lot of gas torches. i think Jack was right that the three of them really DID outnumber the others.

This was my initial thought as well.

[HIMEWAD]

it just seems that for all of the torches to light up at the same time, there had to be a gas line connecting them all. not sure what that means, though.

[ilambert]

Once again....they failed to ask the OBVIOUS QUESTIONS!!!!!

How bout...."how did you others get to the island" "how is Walt special" "what are you others doing on the island" "why did you take some of the tailies".....HELP ME OUT HERE!

[iamaflashback]

you take off your shoes, eat someones food and open doors? desmond????

[joker9989]

Kate begs for forgiveness from Jack and just Jack, why?

[HIMEWAD]

it didn't seem like that guy would have given them any answers, did it? he just wanted them to go back - no questions asked. this encounter didn't really answer any questions.

[Steeevil]

Why does Jack still wear the key around his neck?

[Csizzle]

Well they blew it... I think Jack was right and they outnumbered them but guns are a great equalizer. If someone "trespasses" you shoot them.

[imaguestage]

"How long do you think it will take to train an army?"

That is why I LOVE this show!!!

[Mork]

BEST
ENDING LINE
EVER

[Zelou]

What did jack said at the end of the episode, missed it :(

[joker9989]

Why are you guys ahead?

[lawn_boy]

Quit with the blather we know you get divorced we want the Island!

[imaguestage]

Did anyone else hear Locke refer to himself as "Uncle Johnny"??

[Csizzle]

Hmmm so who on the island will Sara have left Jack for?

[Zelou]

How the hell did you know he'd say, "let's make a fire and talk?" I need a hit off your bong !!
It's the magic tree :Hippy:

[Csizzle]

If they were smart... they should have kept the bullets. Oh well.

[madridgrrl]

what was the name of the record album in the hatch? domino jackson? can't remember.

[Canadianchick]

"How long do you think it will take to train an army?"

That is why I LOVE this show!!!

Oh thank you so much for posting that... My husband opened his mouth at the wrong time and I was about to file divorce papers!!

[vegasidol]

See ya later, 'Jack'.

ie Sawyer. Love it.

[Mysterious Mike]

Lostie Army vs Dharma Army = sweet

[madridgrrl]

Hmmm so who on the island will Sara have left Jack for?
Love that idea -- it's gotta be true!

[imaguestage]

what was the name of the record album in the hatch? domino jackson? can't remember.
Geronimo Jackson

[vegasidol]

So why won't Michael ever find the others, if Jack, Sawyer and Locke did?

[Pieces of Arzt]

I think the album was Geronimo Jackson.

Did anyone else notice the similarity between the Jack/Gabriella kissing scene and the Kate/Jack kissing scene.

Also, why did Jack go to AL to ask about an army? It seems like Sayid might be more useful in that area.

[Ava182]

The question on my mind is, how does Hurley know Lindsay?

[Gunther]

waiting ... waiting ... waiting ... Sometimes i really hate living on the West Coast ...

[m0nwell]

What a great episode. Lock N Load Jack is pissing me off now though.

[Alibrastar]

what was the name of the record album in the hatch? domino jackson? can't remember.


Geronimo-----I can't spell, where's the damn spell check!

[imaguestage]

Lostie Army vs Dharma Army = sweet = season finale???

[MrSocko]

Any speculation on how Captain Bluebeard came into possesion of a German World War II pistol?

[Nevrast]

Hmmm so who on the island will Sara have left Jack for?

Sawyer.

[imaguestage]

Also, why did Jack go to AL to ask about an army? It seems like Sayid might be more useful in that area.

I'm guessing it's because he knows she's already killed an "Other"

[challena]

how did sawyer know the "other" (grizzly adams dude) was named Zeeck? And, at the end, was that a somewhat cleaned up Zeeck walking through the camp looking at Claire holding the baby? Could the other stranded passengers that are nameless who walk in and out of scenes be the actual "others"?

[ScrappleKing]

[QUOTE=imaguestage]"How long do you think it will take to train an army?"

Jack wants to go to the mattresses.

[Diamondduste]

Any speculation on how Captain Bluebeard came into possesion of a German World War II pistol?
Hanso was a munitions/arms dealer.

That can explain how every weapon found its way on the island.

I still say the biggest thing of the episode is that Mr. Friendly/Zeke directly said "Alex". Alex is too important of a name in the show for it to be some other character than Danielle's Alex.

A friend brought up a very good point about Ana Lucia/training the army:

This might alienate Sayid. He's still depressed about Shannon. He wasn't involved in the hunting party, yet he has full millitary training. Jack still goes to Ana Lucia even though he knows Sayid is a fully trained millitary officer. In a perfect situation, both Ana Lucia and Sayid would be good people to train an "army". I know Ana Lucia has killed two "Others" in the past, but still... Sayid would have far better training in his past, even if he was a Communications Officer.

Besides, we already know both Sayid and Ana Lucia can and will torture people.

[challena]

Did anyone else hear Locke refer to himself as "Uncle Johnny"??
Yeah, and then Locke questioned Sawyer on why he doesn't go by James...and Sawyer called Kate, "Freckles".....whats up with the nicknames?

[dallow]

I can't find a thing about an artist named Geronimo Jackson. Made up for the show?

[salem2005]

Interesting how "Zeke" was quoting Alvar Hanso....at least we have confirmation that "Zeke" knows of...working with...Alvar....He's gotta be DeGroot from U of M.

Speaking of U of M....I'm not sure if this was a Nationally televised commercial...or only locally here in Michigan...but the University of Michigan aired a commercial smack dabb in the middle of the show...too funny!

[imaguestage]

I still say the biggest thing of the episode is that Mr. Friendly/Zeke directly said "Alex". Alex is too important of a name in the show for it to be some other character than Danielle's Alex.


Whoa. I totally missed that. When did that happen?

[Diamondduste]

Whoa. I totally missed that. When did that happen?

Right as they were bringing Kate out... Mr. Friendly told "Alex" to bring her out.

[imaguestage]

Right as they were bringing Kate out... Mr. Friendly told "Alex" to bring her out.

Thanks! You're right, has to be Danielle's Alex.

[salem2005]

Right as they were bringing Kate out... Mr. Friendly told "Alex" to bring her out.

It's definitely Danielle's missing daughter, Alex. Like you said...it's too important of a "name" for them to just throw that out there for no reason...especially since we still didn't get to see her...just hear her name.

[Diamondduste]

It's definitely Danielle's missing daughter, Alex. Like you said...it's too important of a "name" for them to just throw that out there for no reason...especially since we still didn't get to see her...just hear her name.

It's called the slow build. :)

Think about it this way -

Just imagine if Sayid had been there with them. He would have been the only one to recognize the significance of that name.

The fact he wasn't with the party was big. You could tell he was a bit shocked that they left without him.

Then Jack goes to ask Ana Lucia about training...

Things like that would build up with a person, especially as they are in a period of grief.

[m0nwell]

So will Michael not be seen around for awhile too? I got my money on memory loss upon arrival.

[lostmio]

It doesn't get any better than this episode!

Light 'em up!
Alex!
Mr. Clean!
Christian Christian Christian!
Libby's cute in that "I've been terrorized by the others for 40 days" kind of way"!
Goodytwoshoes Sarah is a cheater!
Uncle Johnny!
Sayid's depressed!
Locke's out of the hatch playing Daniel Boone!
Charlie's in the hatch!
Geronimo Jackson! (I haven't a clue)
Jack attracted to Kate look-alike Gabrielle!
How long to train an army!
Walt's ok and a special boy!
Michael goes bonkers!
Sun tells Jin how the cow eats cabbage!

I loved every minute of it.....

[Chinamom]

S2E11: “The Hunting Party”

BIG QUESTIONS:
So who was the hunting party--Jack & Co. or Zeke’s gang?
How does Zeke know Locke and Jack’s names?
How did they know Kate was following Jack‘s crew?
ALEX!?!:eek:
How many of “them” are there? Did anyone count the torches? Is that all of “them?”
Where is Walt?
Where is Michael? Why is he going North? What else does he know about the computer that he didn’t tell Jack?

MORE THAN COINCIDENCE:
Sun’s reference to a period of 4 years in her pre-crash life (along with Locke, Sawyer, etc. in previous eps)

SUSPENSION OF DISBELIEF:
A just-revived Locke and recuperating Sawyer would be up to a hike?

QUESTIONS ANSWERED:
Ah...Jack will always need something to fix.
Alex and Walt are with Zeke.
Walt really is “special.”
Why Jack is no longer married.

LOCATIONS FOR THE LOST MAP:
Maybe Italy? (Gabriella and her dad)

NUMBERS:
Ammunition locker combination 25-29-40? (I was so sure it would be 8-1-5)
7 shots, 3 gunshells
Sun’s 4 years of being told what to do

CHARACTERS:

Jack: I guess he kisses crying women because he always needs to fix something. And...”How long do you think it would take to train an army?” WHOA.

Kate: Way to go, Kate! Follow the guys anyway, get Zeke’s gun at your head, and the Oceanic Army loses weapons!:thwak:

Sawyer: So...are he and Kate together or what?

Sayid: “This music is quite depressing.” Not nearly as depressing as Sayid having ALMOST NO SCREEN TIME THIS SEASON.:mad:

Locke: “Who are we to tell anyone what we can or can’t do?” reminiscent of “Don’t tell me what I can’t do!” Also, his question to Sawyer about his name, “Where did you pick it?” was a strange one.

Charlie: Poor Charlie.

Claire: Oh, I hope she and Locke aren’t going to be the next shippers. Clocke?

Sun: Her comment about being told what to do for 4 years...I’m assuming she meant the 4 years she was married to Jin in Korea?

Jin: Dude, good move to put down the pack and stay with your wife.

Hurley: Loved the hatch scene with Charlie! Hurley hearts Libby!

Michael: Hell hath no fury like a crazed parent missing a child...there are a lot of posters telling Michael to calm down, and I’m betting most of them aren’t parents! If one of my kids was snatched right out of my hands, I, too, would be beyond hysterical.

Walt: Has he met Alex?

Vincent: Why didn’t Michael take him along? He found Walt for Shannon...of course, we know what happened when Shannon followed Vincent...

Ana: Oh my, Ana in charge of an army? I don’t know whether to be relieved or terrified.:scared:

Mr. Eko: Sitting in the shade carving on his stick?

Favorite Lines:
Sawyer’s Mr. Clean and Mt. Vesuvius wisecracks!

Literary/pop references:
Geronimo Jackson
Not sure who the other album was?

Seriously Creepy:
Zeke’s “Light ‘em up!” YIKES.

Music:
Kate’s apology scene--remnants of beautiful S1 music. Oh WHEN is that soundtrack
coming???

Shout-out:
Don’t you think Zeke’s response to Jack about Ethan being a spy (“Well that’s an interesting theory”) was for all of us who have wondered the same thing?

Summary:
Very gripping episode all the way around--the confrontation between Jack & Zeke, the conversations between Jack and his dad, the tension between Jack and Sarah. I liked it :)
Next week looks like a nail-biter!:eye-poppi

[salem2005]

Then Jack goes to ask Ana Lucia about training...
Things like that would build up with a person, especially as they are in a period of grief.

I hope Sayid "builds up" his own army!

I understand what you are saying...but to me, it just doesn't make any sense at all for Jack to ask Ana about training an army just because she was a cop...he knows how highly skilled Sayid is when it comes to the army and military...it just didn't sit well with me that he asked her over him...after all, Sayid has already been with him for 50 days on the island, he knows him and trusts him...Ana, he barely knows, yet he goes to her? Doesn't make any sense to me.

[m0nwell]

Locke was most likely asking Sawyer about his name because his dad was named Frank Sawyer at one point of time (as many believe but it hasn't been proven yet). Locke may of found out and was just wondering.

[imaguestage]

Kate: Way to go, Kate! Follow the guys anyway, get Zeke’s gun at your head, and the Oceanic Army loses weapons!:thwak:

Can we from now on refer to them as the "Oceanic Army"? I like it!

[Reality]

Don’t you think Zeke’s response to Jack about Ethan being a spy (“Well that’s an interesting theory”) was for all of us who have wondered the same thing?

I thought Zeke's "Well that's an interesting theory" was in reference to Jack's comment about them outnumbering Zeke, I didn't hear anything about Ethan mentioned

[stag]

I'm betting that if they do indeed train an army that Sayid will be involved also. It would just be too ignorant/stupid not to include him. Jack's a little over the top at times, but he's no idiot.

[imaguestage]

I hope Sayid "builds up" his own army!

I understand what you are saying...but to me, it just doesn't make any sense at all for Jack to ask Ana about training an army just because she was a cop...he knows how highly skilled Sayid is when it comes to the army and military...it just didn't sit well with me that he asked her over him...after all, Sayid has already been with him for 50 days on the island, he knows him and trusts him...Ana, he barely knows, yet he goes to her? Doesn't make any sense to me.

Perhaps he doesn't trust Sayid's state of mind right now after losing Shannon?

[lostmio]

I
Did anyone else notice the similarity between the Jack/Gabriella kissing scene and the Kate/Jack kissing scene.


Oh yeah. Not to mention the eerie resemblance between Kate & Gabrielle.

[stag]

Does anyone think Michael is dead? Also, with all the conspiracy theories about Locke being "in tune with" or a "servant of" the island, does anyone think he stopped and claimed to have lost the trail on purpose? Just some questions...

[imaguestage]

I thought Zeke's "Well that's an interesting theory" was in reference to Jack's comment about them outnumbering Zeke, I didn't hear anything about Ethan mentioned

Jack talks to him about outnumbering them and that they have to sen a spy into their camp, Ethan and Zeke replies "Well, that's an interesting theory."

[salem2005]

I thought Zeke's "Well that's an interesting theory" was in reference to Jack's comment about them outnumbering Zeke, I didn't hear anything about Ethan mentioned

Jack said Ethan's name and was kind of inferring that Ethan was one of Zeke's men...that's when Zeke said it was an interesting theory. Based on this...I don't think that Ethan/Goodwin are working with Zeke. Zeke (aka DeGroot from U of M has his own group of people that are doing their own thing). Ethan/Goodwin are from some other group.

[imaguestage]

Jack said Ethan's name and was kind of inferring that Ethan was one of Zeke's men...that's when Zeke said it was an interesting theory. Based on this...I don't think that Ethan/Goodwin are working with Zeke. Zeke (aka DeGroot from U of M has his own group of people that are doing their own thing). Ethan/Goodwin are from some other group.

I totally agree. The ones who attacked the tailies are grouped together with Ethan and they have the kids from the tail section. Zeke and Alex have Walt and Michael.

[salem2005]

Perhaps he doesn't trust Sayid's state of mind right now after losing Shannon?

Maybe that is one way the writers could explain this...but it still doesn't make much sense to me. Maybe if he and Sayid together came to Ana and asked for her help it would be more believable to me.

[matty1]

I think the reason jack did not ask sayid to train an army is because sayid has become an upstanding citizen now. He knows Ana Lucia is up to getting down and dirty with him. I think he knows Sayid would try to talk him out of it.

[imaguestage]

Maybe that is one way the writers could explain this...but it still doesn't make much sense to me. Maybe if he and Sayid together came to Ana and asked for her help it would be more believable to me.

I agree it would be more believable. I think it is just a way for the writers to include AL back in the show. Up until now she has had nothing to contribute.

[lostmio]

Fellow Christian groupies - did you notice how quickly and emphatically he tried to quash the notion that Sarah's successful recovery could be duplicated?

That man KNOWS the truth behind Sarah's 'cure' and he knows Jack didn't do it....

[m0nwell]

I totally agree. The ones who attacked the tailies are grouped together with Ethan and they have the kids from the tail section. Zeke and Alex have Walt and Michael.

I personally think that Zeke has Walt but Goodwin/Ethan's group has Michael. This reminds me of the hippy vs. hippy thread. The beginning speech from Zeke was very hippyish.

[salem2005]

I agree it would be more believable. I think it is just a way for the writers to include AL back in the show. Up until now she has had nothing to contribute.

Oh, that's right, I forgot that Ana is Jack's new co-star on this show! :mad:

[salem2005]

Fellow Christian groupies - did you notice how quickly and emphatically he tried to quash the notion that Sarah's successful recovery could be duplicated?

That man KNOWS the truth behind Sarah's 'cure' and he knows Jack didn't do it....

That thought crossed my mind also...and I still don't believe that we have seen the last of Jack's dad yet on this island...he's out there...somewhere...involved in all of this in some way....

[lostmio]

Lock N Load Jack is pissing me off now though.

But he's bumping us into a whole exciting new story line...
SQUEEEEEE

[Dorkfish]

Okay now we can add two more names to "Sawyer' Nicknames" list:

1. Mr. Clean (Referring to Locke)
2. Zeek (Reffering to Mr. Friendly)

Also, did anybody think that Charlie sounded REALLY desperate when he asked Hurley if Claire missed him? That was HILARIOUS! And I love it when Hurley tells him that it has only been a day! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH.............HAHAHAHA.......... ........HAHAH...........HAHAH..................HA
Okay......HAHA.............Okay,Okay.............. HA..........I'm Done Now!



HA!

[Diamondduste]

I personally think that Zeke has Walt but Goodwin/Ethan's group has Michael. This reminds me of the hippy vs. hippy thread. The beginning speech from Zeke was very hippyish.

It should... it was a quote from Hanso. The one about curiosity... it's on the front page of http://www.thehansofoundation.org

[4brat]

I personally think that Jack went to Ana BECAUSE he knew Sayid was grieving. Maybe the thought was it was something that needed to be handled right NOW and Sayid isn't at 100%. I think they will both become involved with the training (lots of tension/triangle potential here) and the season will end with the "army" setting out on a hunt for others. IMHO

[salem2005]

The beginning speech from Zeke was very hippyish.

That's because "Zeke" is really DeGroot from U of M....and DeGroot worked for Hanso...and he was quoting directly from Alvar Hanso....

[mystjade]

I belived Jack went to Ana rather then to sayid first, because she had more experence with the others . . .

Also it's funny Julie Bowen was on party of 5 (matthew fox's old show) as a love intrest for his charichter there (charlie) as well.

[Diamondduste]

Jack said Ethan's name and was kind of inferring that Ethan was one of Zeke's men...that's when Zeke said it was an interesting theory. Based on this...I don't think that Ethan/Goodwin are working with Zeke. Zeke (aka DeGroot from U of M has his own group of people that are doing their own thing). Ethan/Goodwin are from some other group.

Could be the test subjects vs. the people who were running the tests. :)

[salem2005]

I belived Jack went to Ana rather then to sayid first, because she had more experence with the others . . .

I'm not buying that....I'd take an Iraqi soldier trained in torture techniques anyday over an LAPD cop....

[stag]

Just a question, but how many more episodes are planned for this season? For some reason I was under the impression it would only be two or three more til the season finale. As slow as the time in the show moves that doesn't seem like enough time to train an army.

[lilmeezer]

"How long do you think it will take to train an army?"

That is why I LOVE this show!!!

Hello,

New here.

Is this what Jack said to Ana Lucia at the end of the episode?

I record it, and my dvr cut it off right after he sat down and asked her if she had shot "One of them."

Help!

Thanks bunches.

Alison

[qch13]

Could be the test subjects vs. the people who were running the tests. :) I think you could be on to something.

[Diamondduste]

I'm not buying that....I'd take an Iraqi soldier trained in torture techniques anyday over an LAPD cop....

So would I, but we've already seen that Ana Lucia is not above torture.

I honestly think this whole situation will cause Danielle to assist the survivors... especially if someone mentions the fact that the name "Alex" was spoken. Sayid might seek her out - he's lost someone he loved just like Danielle did.

[redneck once removed]

So why won't Michael ever find the others, if Jack, Sawyer and Locke did?


Jack& co. didn't find 'others', the others found them!

BUT- don't you think if the 'others' know everything the losties are doing, then they will also know if they start
training and preparing to come and fight!?!

[Diamondduste]

Just a question, but how many more episodes are planned for this season? For some reason I was under the impression it would only be two or three more til the season finale. As slow as the time in the show moves that doesn't seem like enough time to train an army.

I think there will be 24 total episodes this season.

[4brat]

Just a question, but how many more episodes are planned for this season? For some reason I was under the impression it would only be two or three more til the season finale. As slow as the time in the show moves that doesn't seem like enough time to train an army.
The training could be all of season three, you're right time does drag a bit.

[ammrt]

Also, why did Jack go to AL to ask about an army? It seems like Sayid might be more useful in that area.[/quote]
That's what I'm saying. If I want to train an army, I'm going to the guy who was trained by the Iraqi's to KILL, not the ex-cop who was trained to protect and serve, even if the cop is a bit trigger happy, (okay, I'm starting to like her).
I don't think the "nameless" characters are Others. If they were, they would have noticed that they weren't on the flight manifest. There obviously just more interested in working on their tan's and swimming, then noticing all the wierdness on the island.

[Diamondduste]

The training could be all of season three, you're right time does drag a bit.

This is just speculation - but I think we'll see some type of assault on "The Others" just in time for the season finale.

[salem2005]

This is just speculation - but I think we'll see some type of assault on "The Others" just in time for the season finale.

Yep...I'm right there speculating about this with you...it's definitely one way to leave us hanging this summer....

[lostmio]

SUSPENSION OF DISBELIEF:
A just-revived Locke and recuperating Sawyer would be up to a hike?


Going up the hill, Locke was gasping for air and Sawyer was lagging and favoring his shoulder. They both wanted to stop at the top of the hill for a rest. Nice realistic touch for a tv show, I thought.

[NokomisIsABadRobot]

Ugh.... I dont even feel like talking tonight..

Great show though.

[4brat]

I am new here so I am not sure exactly how to do this, but a local radio station posted this link and it is REALLY interesting. http://www.4815162342.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3377

[imaguestage]

Jack& co. didn't find 'others', the others found them!

BUT- don't you think if the 'others' know everything the losties are doing, then they will also know if they start
training and preparing to come and fight!?!

The fact that they knew their names and what they were doing, I assumed that to mean that Zeke and co. had been following them for a while, listening to them.

[salem2005]

No one responded to my question earlier in this thread about the University of Michigan commercial...did that air nationally? Or just locally here in Michigan? Either way, I burst out loug laughing when I saw it...U of M doesn't air that many commercials as it is...hmmm, that's one University that is watching this show very closely! And what a nice touch to air their commercial during the episode where we pretty much find out that "Zeke" is DeGroot!

[MooMaker]

Long time reader...second time poster...LOVED this episode. I am excited about the prospect of an army and a war against the Others. But I agree that we'll probably have to wait until next season to see what comes from a war.
Also, I'm not sure I think there are two groups of Others. I just believe there is one group and the Losties are going to fight the Others then they can have access to all of the Other's "stuff" and be able to get off the island.
What about the French woman, Danielle? I she coming back into the picture at all??

[Lostraveler9]

Question: Why did Sawyer call Capt. Gorton, Zeke?
Was it, 1. Another one of Sawyer's nickname's he gives ppl ?
2. Does Sawyer KNOW Zeke from before the palne crash?

[salem2005]

What about the French woman, Danielle? I she coming back into the picture at all??

She will once she finds out that her daughter, Alex is alive!!!!

[4brat]

I think Zeke called them by name to rattle their cages. Obviously, the whole bunker is watched very closely and he wanted to make sure that everyone was clear on that.

[Homer Noodleman]

Jack went to Ana because he's upset over how he feels about Kate.

[4brat]

No Michigan commercial in Iowa.

[MooMaker]

She will once she finds out that her daughter, Alex is alive!!!!

Do we KNOW Alex is alive? How?

[That B Guy]

Ok episode overall and not nearly as intense or entertaining as last week's Eko episode. In my opinion they could have tossed out all of Jack's flashbacks and showed more of the island, especially Jack's crew asking questions to the group of people that has invoked fear on them for so long...

I'm thinking Zeke is part of the life extension project when Jack mentions that he and the others have been there for about 50 days Zeke finds that funny. This could be interpretted as they have been there for 20 years, but I think he's showing that they have been there for well over 50 years(considering the German WWII pistol) and the life extension project is keeping them younger.

[salem2005]

I think Zeke called them by name to rattle their cages. Obviously, the whole bunker is watched very closely and he wanted to make sure that everyone was clear on that.

Yes, I believe they are "watching" them...I think it will tie-in to the Hanso foundation's Accelerated Remote Viewing Training Facility.....

[CHFDigital]

It should... it was a quote from Hanso. The one about curiosity... it's on the front page of http://www.thehansofoundation.org

Thanks, Diamond. I was going to ask about that quote and where it came from. This confirms that Zeke has ties to Hanso, obviously...
Chris (who's putting Obvious Guy to sleep)

[salem2005]

Do we KNOW Alex is alive? How?

Well, when Zeke screamed: ALEX, BRING HER OUT - and then someone pushed Kate out of the bushes...I think it's pretty clear that this was Danielle's Alex...

[CHFDigital]

I'm not buying that....I'd take an Iraqi soldier trained in torture techniques anyday over an LAPD cop....

Hmmm...someone who was taught how to be a part of an army or someone trained in prevention. ;)

Sayid is the one to go to here. I'm guessing Jack will loop Sayid in later...
Chris

[salem2005]

Jack went to Ana because he's upset over how he feels about Kate.

Huh? How does that justify him asking Ana to train his army versus Sayid (you know the guy who was actually in the military!)

[Mysterious Mike]

ScrappleKing- Jack wants to go to the mattresses.



:rotfl: so Jack = Michael Corleone


Any speculation on how Captain Bluebeard came into possesion of a German World War II pistol?




The Luger was a widely produced gun and was considered the most reliable pistol of the WW2 era . He seems to know or knew Alvar Hanso from his quote and as was stated earlier he was an arms dealer in another life.

[Diamondduste]

Question: Why did Sawyer call Capt. Gorton, Zeke?
Was it, 1. Another one of Sawyer's nickname's he gives ppl ?
2. Does Sawyer KNOW Zeke from before the palne crash?

Just another nickname. Zeke carries a connotation of a hillbilly in this instance. That's what Sawyer was going for by calling him Zeke.

[MooMaker]

Well, when Zeke screamed: ALEX, BRING HER OUT - and then someone pushed Kate out of the bushes...I think it's pretty clear that this was Danielle's Alex...
OH, WOW, I didn't even realize that is what he said. !!!!!!!

[salem2005]

No Michigan commercial in Iowa.

thanks for the confirmation on this...it must have been just local...but like I said, it was too funny to have U of M pop up all over my tv screen during this show!

[stag]

Does anyone other than Sayid know about Alex? Specifically, does Jack, Locke or Sawyer know? Sorry, I can't remember all that.

[4brat]

I don't remember who was in the scene when Danielle went into what happened to Alex, I am thinking it was more then just Sayid though. Wasn't Clare and Charlie there? That was why they were freaking out over the baby.

[Diamondduste]

Ok episode overall and not nearly as intense or entertaining as last week's Eko episode. In my opinion they could have tossed out all of Jack's flashbacks and showed more of the island, especially Jack's crew asking questions to the group of people that has invoked fear on them for so long...

I'm thinking Zeke is part of the life extension project when Jack mentions that he and the others have been there for about 50 days Zeke finds that funny. This could be interpretted as they have been there for 20 years, but I think he's showing that they have been there for well over 50 years(considering the German WWII pistol) and the life extension project is keeping them younger.

Remember this:

We now know there is an old WWII German Pistol(Which would bring up those ever so lovely Nazi theories that surfaced months ago) and an old US Army knife on the island.

Kind of makes you wonder... even with Hanso being an arms dealer.

[salem2005]

Does anyone other than Sayid know about Alex? Specifically, does Jack, Locke or Sawyer know? Sorry, I can't remember all that.

I think I remember Sayid telling Jack that Danielle's baby daughter was kidnapped, but I'm not sure if he ever mentioned her name to him. I think he did mention the name Alex to Charlie when they were looking for Claire's baby.

[CHFDigital]

That's because "Zeke" is really DeGroot from U of M....and DeGroot worked for Hanso...and he was quoting directly from Alvar Hanso....

Salem, I don't think we have any proof of that-- or did I miss something??
Chris

[Diamondduste]

I don't remember who was in the scene when Danielle went into what happened to Alex, I am thinking it was more then just Sayid though. Wasn't Clare and Charlie there? That was why they were freaking out over the baby.

I think Charlie, Claire, and Sayid are the only ones who know about Alex. Charlie was with Sayid in the season finale when Danielle explained how she wanted to swap Aaron for Alex. I can't directly remember a scene where she mentioned Alex in front of Claire.

[stag]

It just occurred to me that maybe Jack went to Ana L. to train the army because he had other plans for Sayid, such as bringing in Danielle. But I'm not sure if Jack knows who Alex is, so that could just be a silly notion I had.

[matty1]

In response to 4brat
Why did he only call Jack and Locke by name? He didn't call Kate or Sawyer by name and didn't name Micheal first, Jack did. He had several opportunities to call sawyer by name when sawyer tried to shoot him twice. It would have had alot of impact to to say kate was following you instead of "this one" was following you. Everyone on the beach knows sawyer, if they were spying how could they not know him especially since he was also with the tallies for a time.

[SeanDude05]

Just because it looks like a Luger, doesn't mean it was from WWII. That same look of pistol was manufactured up until only a bit ago. 1980s?

[salem2005]

Salem, I don't think we have any proof of that-- or did I miss something??
Chris

No, I don't have any real "proof", but I have always thought that they resembled each other (based on the orientation video) and I also think the blond chick from the boat is Mrs. DeGroot (since she also looks like the lady DeGroot in the orientation video). And when he started spouting off Alvar Hanso quotes tonight...I made that leap (I could however be jumping off the wrong bridge)...but that's my theory and I'm sticking to it!

[That B Guy]

What was it that hit Sawyer in the neck by the way? At first I thought it was some type of blow dart.

[Homer Noodleman]

Huh? How does that justify him asking Ana to train his army versus Sayid (you know the guy who was actually in the military!)

When has Jack ever demonstrated he's had a brain in his head?

He went to another woman because he's upset over Kate. He thinks Kate and Sawyer are an item. The jungle kiss reminded him of both him cheating on his wife by kissing the Italian babe, as well as his ex cheating on him.

Remember, he already gone to Ana after that kiss -- he's going to her trying to get away from his feelings for Kate. He had asked Kate to watch his back, feeling betrayed by her, he is transfering his hopes to Ana.

[Diamondduste]

What was it that hit Sawyer in the neck by the way? At first I thought it was some type of blow dart.

A bullet grazed him - meaning Sawyer got hit by a gun shot YET again :)

[salem2005]

When has Jack ever demonstrated he's had a brain in his head?

You're right....Jack = No Brain.

[CHFDigital]

No, I don't have any real "proof", but I have always thought that they resembled each other (based on the orientation video) and I also think the blond chick from the boat is Mrs. DeGroot (since she also looks like the lady DeGroot in the orientation video). And when he started spouting off Alvar Hanso quotes tonight...I made that leap (I could however be jumping off the wrong bridge)...but that's my theory and I'm sticking to it!

Ok, thanks bud. Just checking...
Chris

[salem2005]

A bullet grazed him - meaning Sawyer got hit by a gun shot YET again :)

Yeah, but was it one of their own bullets that hit him? It almost seemed like they shot directly at Zeke and the bullet somehow hit something and came back at him...almost like Zeke was "protected" by something on "his side of the line."

[4brat]

In response to 4brat
Why did he only call Jack and Locke by name? He didn't call Kate or Sawyer by name and didn't name Micheal first, Jack did. He had several opportunities to call sawyer by name when sawyer tried to shoot him twice. It would have had alot of impact to to say kate was following you instead of "this one" was following you. Everyone on the beach knows sawyer, if they were spying how could they not know him especially since he was also with the tallies for a time.
Maybe he recognized Jack and Locke as the alpha males. The whole beat-up-the-biggest-bully-first-and-the-rest-will-run-theory? I really hadn't caught that he didn't call sawyer or Kate by name. I believe that the bunker is monitered very closely and that is why Michael found a clue he was looking for, they allowed him to communicate with Walt. I personally don't think it was Walt, too pat for this show. I think it was them luring Michael out because maybe Walt refused to do his special thing without his Dad? Just a thougth to throw out there.

[Jinjur]

Great call Homer. I wonder what will Danielle do when she finds out where Alex is at...and who's in charge. Sayid really should team up with AL and they should train the losties to fight, cause I think they are soon to find they have enemies on both sides. I find it curious that the Captain responded to the question of spies the way he did. He is almost certainly implying that there is one amonst the castaways themselves (maybe locke?). He also did seem uncomforatable at the mention of Ethan. I think LOST has just been given the shot of epinephrin we've all been waiting for. hoo-rah!

[4brat]

Yeah, but was it one of their own bullets that hit him? It almost seemed like they shot directly at Zeke and the bullet somehow hit something and came back at him...almost like Zeke was "protected" by something on "his side of the line."



It reminded me of the Incredibiles when Violet threw up a force field and Dash bounced off it. that was my first thought anyway

[Kate is sexy]

Zeeke mention Locke and Jack by names because just before he interupted them they both were arguing pretty loud and both mention each others name at least once. Thast why Zeeke dint say Sawyer's name or Kate's name. He was basically yards way while they both argued about if they should go back or if they should keep on.

[matty1]

So now that we got the outstayed our welcome houseguest speech - what does that make Desmond? They seemed to have tolerated him fairly well for 3 years.

[Kate is sexy]

I posted this theory in another forum.

I think they lured Michael to somehow get a hold the more powerfull guns.
So far from what we have seen the others had some home made explosives and only 2 or 3 guns and 1 of them is an old gun from WW II, now they have 2 rifles and 3 more 9mm's.

I think Jack was right about them outnumbering them and as a whole meaning 44+ survivors to like what ever number of others.

[limernick]

The Losties have been on the island for 50 days-according to Jack in tonight's episode-the amount of time that the Isrealites waited at Mt Sinai to receive the Ten Commandments from Moses. Now next week we have an episode about Aaron, with images of a baby on the water and a burning bush??? Hmmmm...

Go Mizzou!
LN

[dreamfall]

Does anyone other than Sayid know about Alex? Specifically, does Jack, Locke or Sawyer know? Sorry, I can't remember all that.

When Danielle came into the camp during Exodus (or right before it) she mentioned her daughter Alex being taken. But I can't remember who exactly she said it to. I'm pretty sure Micheal and Walt were both there, because Walt saw her walk into camp.

Either way, it's entirely possible that they don't remember that little detail. Most of the time Danielle is referred to as "the french chick," so I wouldn't be surpised if they didn't even remember her daughters actual name. They'd remember the fact her daughter was taken though.


---

I'm so mad at Kate for ruining it all. Why does she feel the need to always be involved in everything? Honestly, what good did she think following them would have, especially since she was unarmed?


Also, I hated the flashbacks. They were dull and predictable. As soon as I saw Gabriella I knew she would have a thing for Jack. And I had a feeling he wouldn't be able to duplicate his miracle.

I was happy, although not surprised, when Gabriella and Jack kissed. I thought it was daring to show Jack being the cheater who causes the dimise of his own marriage. But instead they have him immediately confess and proclaim he wants to fix their marriage, and then showing his wife as an even bigger cheater so Jack's little mishap can be easily forgotten in the bigger scheme of things.

That would have builded on the theme that all the characters are looking for redemption. Instead they made Sarah the villian to keep Jack sympathetic.

[Choppin Broccoli]

I haven't seen a lot of these things discussed, but I thought they were significant, so here goes.

1. One thing we know for sure: Jack's tattoos came AFTER his wife left him. What significance that has, I have no idea, but they made it a point to show us that Jack didn't have any tattoos when he took his shirt off and got into bed. If it wasn't significant, why would they bother covering them up for the flashback?

2. The Gorton's Fisherman knew Jack and Locke's names (and I think Michael's), but I noticed he never addressed Sawyer or Kate by name. If you think back to the episode centering on the "Tail-Enders," there is some reference to the list the Others have, and their "mole" says something about children being innocent or pure or something, and that was why they were taking the children. Could it be that the Others knew Jack's and Locke's names because they are on the "good" list, but didn't know Kate's and Sawyer's names because they're not? Is this setting up a "Good v. Evil" battle of some kind? Come to think of it, Captain Gorton DID kind of look like Santa Claus (with his Naughty and Nice lists).

3. We remember that Locke reset the gun room's combination lock to something significant he could remember. It was hard to hear, but when Locke shouted the combination through the door to Sawyer, it sounded like he said it was 25, 29, 40. These numbers are significant to Locke. What is their significance? One could argue that the 25 and 40 fit in with all the Biblical references that have been popping up lately (the 25th is Christmas, and the number 40 is all over the Bible--Noah was on the Ark 40 days, Jesus stayed on Earth 40 days after his rebirth before ascending to Heaven). But I have no idea what the 29 would be (if I actually heard 29--I really had to strain to hear it over the other noise).

4. Captain Gorton's eyes both seemed to be facing the same direction tonight (as opposed to when he was on the boat). There was a glass eye found in the chest in the "Tail-Enders'" hatch which we were led to believe belonged to Captain Gorton. But both his eyes looked real tonight. By the way, what did he mean by, "Walt's a very special boy"?

5. When Sawyer calls Locke "Mr. Clean," Locke asks him why he picked that name. But I don't think he meant "Mr. Clean" OR why he picked the name Sawyer for himself. I think he was really asking Sawyer why he chose to call the hill they were climbing "Mt. Vesuvius." Vesuvius was the volcano that destroyed Pompeii. If you look at the painting in the hatch, isn't there some reference to a volcano somewhere on the island?

6. Why is it that every time Sawyer shoots at Captain Gorton, he ends up getting shot himself (it happened on the raft and again tonight, even though I don't think Sawyer was hit tonight)? Hmmmmmm.

7. Yes, we know that Alex is one of the Others, but we still don't know what gender Alex is, OR what he/she looks like. All we got tonight was an arm.

8. Geronimo Jackson??? Is that some kind of reference to the old joke about penis size (the one where a woman tells a guy that the two cultures with the biggest penises are Native Americans and the Amish, and the guy tells her his name is Geronimo Yoder)?

9. Michael says the computer isn't what everyone thinks it is. What does Michael know about the computer? Obviously, Walt (or the person purporting to be Walt on the computer) told Michael where to come looking for him. Did he also tell him more about what the computer actually does?

10. Sawyer gets all the best lines. "There's my favorite leaf," and "This ain't over, Zeke," were two of my favorites.

Discuss.

[bhambulldog]

I am glad that this was brought up ... my first thought was that Sawyer had fired his gun and hit something and it had bounced back and hit him ... not sure why that was my first thought

[rknorton91]

Interesting episode

I think Locke was told in a vision to help Micheal go look for his son. He taught him to use the weapon and gave him clear shots of opportunity to do a hit and grab on the gun even though he knew that Micheal was inclined to do so. Then tried his best to discourage the chase of Micheal durning the search, much like the time they were going after Claire.


This may a be a bit offbase but when they first showed the old man before they cut to commercial when they just highlighted the eyes. My first thought was they looked like Jacks Fathers eyes but then when you saw him fully lite it did not. Did anyone else think something similar? or do you think they just intentionally showed of the eyes to make you think something strange about the face?

[bhambulldog]

I can not wait to see who Jack's wife is with ... does anyone think that it could be Desmond ? What a wild twist that would be ?

[challena]

Remember in Rosemary's Baby, the high priest guy's name actually spelled another--his real identity...Could Geronimo Jackson actually mean something or some one else by re-arranging the letters?

A cleaned up Zeke walked right through camp at the end and looked at Claires baby. I think the others are the actual other 40 odd survivors embedded around the main characters. Jack never says to get "everyone else" to the caves or the beach but refers to them as "the others."

I am new to watching the show....saw the 1 st season through re-runs. I like everyone's theories....

[dreamfall]

So now that we got the outstayed our welcome houseguest speech - what does that make Desmond? They seemed to have tolerated him fairly well for 3 years.

Maybe it's because Desmond always did exactly what he was supposed to do. He was a "polite" houseguest, whereas the survivors haven't been. I don't know how Desmond would be any different, other than he stayed in the hatch and minded his own business, but it's just a thought.

[Kate is sexy]

---

I'm so mad at Kate for ruining it all. Why does she feel the need to always be involved in everything? Honestly, what good did she think following them would have, especially since she was unarmed?


Also, I hated the flashbacks. They were dull and predictable. As soon as I saw Gabriella I knew she would have a thing for Jack. And I had a feeling he wouldn't be able to duplicate his miracle.

I was happy, although not surprised, when Gabriella and Jack kissed. I thought it was daring to show Jack being the cheater who causes the dimise of his own marriage. But instead they have him immediately confess and proclaim he wants to fix their marriage, and then showing his wife as an even bigger cheater so Jack's little mishap can be easily forgotten in the bigger scheme of things.

That would have builded on the theme that all the characters are looking for redemption. Instead they made Sarah the villian to keep Jack sympathetic.

Yeah I hated the fact that Kate had to go and mess everything up.
Also about Jack isnt that his biggest fault the fact that he tries to makes things right all the time. The fact that he wants to fix everything like his wife suggested. So yeah it was pretty predictable that his wife was the biggest cheat and not him and to top it off she leaves him instead of the other way around.

[Mimi]

Wow! Great episode.

Okay...did I miss something? How did Sawyer know Zeke's name? Did he introduce himself as Zeke? Maybe I missed it...

Jack: Now we know why he got divorced. He locked lips, but that ain't half as bad as his wife having an affair for a while. He was never around. Too bad they split. Now he is single...but he is still sad. Always needs something to fix...no wonder he is seen as the "leader" of the group.

Kate: What a punk! "Jack told me I can't go, but I am going to follow them anyway...I always get my way." She ruined the whole thing. What a dip! I liked her until this episde...I hope she redeems herself in my eyes.

{Maybe Jack should hook up with Ana-Lucia...I am liking her better and better these days. They can be the commanders of the army together:) ) That army line was great by the way...great way to end the episode!

Michael: I understand why he went commando. If that were my son out there...I would have done the same thing. It's too bad he got caught now...either they captured him because he knew too much, or maybe he is valuable to them now...either way, he is still alive cause zeke said he is fine.
Michael obviously knew which direction to head...so Walt must have told him which way to go to find him...North somewhere???

It makes me mad that Kate ruined it, because they could have bought themselves some more time before things got out of hand. They could have asked questions like..."Where are Walt and Michael? Why do you need them? Etc." Why Jack...you had a few minutes before Kate showed up..why didn't you just ask him???

Zeke's reply to the Ethan question was weird. I wonder if they really are on the same team or not? I know Zeke is from the boat, but are they the same "Others" who took people from the tailies camp?

Alex: definitely there. She is the one who threw out Kate.

Hurley: He likes Libby. Love is in the air!

Charlie misses Claire...but it doesn't look like she is missing him too much.

Jin: Thanks for sticking by your wife! Now he understands what it was like to be told what to do...he will be nicer to her all around...since he realizes that is what she had to put up with.

Vincent: It's a good thing he made a new friend in AL, cause it doesn't look like Michael or Walt are coming back anytime soon.

Sayid: Still looks very sad...poor guy.

Sawyer: I loved his lines in this movie...Mr. Clean...what a riot! Sheesh! The tension between him and Jack about Kate...was kind of thick.

Locke: "See ya later James!" Classic!

It's too bad Jack kissed Gabriella back, but his marriage was over already.

Zeke: "Light 'em up!" Freaky! I had no idea they were surrounded. How in the heck do they light up torches and distinguish them that fast? They must also have a supply of gas in a bunker somewhere...because they can get around on their boat just fine...and it doesn't look like Zeke boats into a public island to get supplies...since he looks pretty grungy all the time...they must have tons of supplies somewhere.

When are we ever going to see Walt? I guess they can't be showing him anytime soon...cause then we would see the Others and they want to keep that in the dark for a while.

Why would Zeke and his crew not hurt Jack and his crew? Are they really the same sneaky others that snatched people from the tailies camp, walks through the jungle so quietly, and doesn't mind killing. This guy had no problem talking to them and showing them his face. Weird.

Next weeks episode looks good! Poor Aaron. Why in the heck is he drifting in a basket in the water? It reminds me of Aaron's brother MOSES...who drifted in a basket to avoid being killed. Hmmm...any significance? Same name? References? Etc.? It looks like the Others get Aaron in the end after all?!!

Post away people! :)

[rknorton91]

Did not the French woman tell us Alex was her daughter back at the end of season one?

[Sproutster]

In response to 4brat
Why did he only call Jack and Locke by name? He didn't call Kate or Sawyer by name and didn't name Micheal first, Jack did. He had several opportunities to call sawyer by name when sawyer tried to shoot him twice. It would have had alot of impact to to say kate was following you instead of "this one" was following you. Everyone on the beach knows sawyer, if they were spying how could they not know him especially since he was also with the tallies for a time.

BECAUSE DESMOND ONLY MET JACK AND LOCKE (oh and Kate... but I believe!!) hehe.

[bhambulldog]

Also I noticed that a few pages back on this post that someone said that Zeke was Degrute (prob spelled that wrong) ... are we for sure about that ? I think that I have missed something ... Degrute was the guy that was in the window right ?? The one that has been said may be Jacks dad as well ???

[Homer Noodleman]

Yea, and we know who's step-sister she is.

[4brat]

In all honesty, I don't really care about Jack's FB if they are all going to be as dull as tonights. I would really like to see more Sayid, Sawyer, Libby somebody that might provide some depth. Jack is done, Locke is done, Kate is done, Jin and Sun are done.

[mystjade]

I am not sure if we will ever see jack's wife again.

Also the significance of the line our Island. Seem's very important. Particulerly when Zeke (short for izekial?) makes it clear that htere biggest problem is with the hatch. Or seems to make it clear. But desmond wasn't as far as we know an other, and he was able to stay down there. Also they didn't attack the hatch themselves, which mean's that they are not particulerly attached to it, or it mean's that they don't want to hurt the survivior's, or they don't belive they can defeat them. Also it implies that they were orignally part of the Dharma initiative

[default305]

I just starting watching this season, anyway how do you know the bearded man is named Zeke? Did they say it before or something?

thanks

[challena]

I just starting watching this season, anyway how do you know the bearded man is named Zeke? Did they say it before or something?

thanks

I have the same question.....:confused:

[salem2005]

Also I noticed that a few pages back on this post that someone said that Zeke was Degrute (prob spelled that wrong) ... are we for sure about that ? I think that I have missed something ... Degrute was the guy that was in the window right ?? The one that has been said may be Jacks dad as well ???

Actually, it's just my opinion, nothing to prove it. I'm making a big leap here by saying Zeke is DeGroot...it's just a hunch based on the fact that I still think he resembles the DeGroot in the orientation video. As does the blond chick on the boat that took Walt resemble Mrs. DeGroot from the orientation video.

But DeGroot was NOT the guy in the window...DeGroot was on of the main scientists who was working on all these scientific theories and experiments at the University of Michigan. The guy in the window was Alvar Hanso...he is the guy who ends up funding the DeGroots research projects. And Zeke was quoting Alvar Hanso directly in his little speech tonight (about curiousity), so I made my leap of faith that they are one in the same person.

But again, no proof, just my hunch.

[salem2005]

I just starting watching this season, anyway how do you know the bearded man is named Zeke? Did they say it before or something?

thanks

I think the general consensus is that the name "Zeke" is just another one of Sawyer's nicknames for people....

[Kate is sexy]

I just starting watching this season, anyway how do you know the bearded man is named Zeke? Did they say it before or something?

thanks

No his name is not Zeeke.

Sawyer just likes to give everybody a nickname just the way he called Locke Mr Clean. Since you are new to the show I guess this is new to you to, but thats why he called him Zeeke. Also he knew him from when he got shot on the raft, but no he dint learn his name during that encounter.

[dreamfall]

Yeah I hated the fact that Kate had to go and mess everything up.
Also about Jack isnt that his biggest fault the fact that he tries to makes things right all the time. The fact that he wants to fix everything like his wife suggested. So yeah it was pretty predictable that his wife was the biggest cheat and not him and to top it off she leaves him instead of the other way around.


Yeah, his need to fix things is definately his tragic flaw. It's what makes him great, but it's always what drags him down in the end.

Still, the end of their marriage was both of their faults. Jack was busy with work and Sarah felt neglected, but she didn't tell him that. When they were in bed and Sarah told Jack about her negative pregnancy results, Jack wants to talk, but Sarah doesn't.

They didn't need Sarah cheating to tell the story, they stopped talking and became strangers, that's why their marriage ended. Sarah's who "I've been seeing someone else" line just feels like it was there to keep Jack likeable.

Maybe it's not. Maybe they'll use this as a basis for his next flashback. But at this point, I'm just hoping there won't be one. I remember thinking Jack's last flashback was really boring too.

[bhambulldog]

I think the general consensus is that the name "Zeke" is just another one of Sawyer's nicknames for people....

that is kindda the way i took it as well

[bhambulldog]

Actually, it's just my opinion, nothing to prove it. I'm making a big leap here by saying Zeke is DeGroot...it's just a hunch based on the fact that I still think he resembles the DeGroot in the orientation video. As does the blond chick on the boat that took Walt resemble Mrs. DeGroot from the orientation video.

But DeGroot was NOT the guy in the window...DeGroot was on of the main scientists who was working on all these scientific theories and experiments at the University of Michigan. The guy in the window was Alvar Hanso...he is the guy who ends up funding the DeGroots research projects. And Zeke was quoting Alvar Hanso directly in his little speech tonight (about curiousity), so I made my leap of faith that they are one in the same person.

But again, no proof, just my hunch.

ok cool thanks for the recap ... i need to go back and rewatch some of those episodes ... i am getting some of the people mixed up

[LandPirate]

1. Good observation. I don't spend a lot of time looking a Micahel Fox's chest, so I'll take your word for it.
2. I think it is possible if not probable that he heard Jack and Locke refer to each other by name shortly before making his appearance.
3. I think TPTB already regret the existing numbers that they will never be able to explain, don't think they are thinking up new ones.
5. At first I was confused, but I think they made it pretty clear that Locke was referring to the name 'Sawyer'.
7. alex is female, check the 'things we know for sure' thread
8. I sure hope not.

[matty1]

Okay so this could be completely out there but I always thought the woman who jack's dad sliced through the hepatic artery was Jack's now ex-wife. He seemed to be okay covering up for dad until the pregnancy proclomation. Explains the random dicussion of her ( jack's wife )negative pregnancy test.

[Jinjur]

Hey great catch sproutster I didn't think about the fact that Jack and Locke were the only two that desmond knew the names of and kate of course. But that would explain things without there having to have been a spy in the camp I suppose. Or they could have heard them fighting...I don't know.

[bhambulldog]

I know one thing for sure ... Locke is getting WEIRD !!! I wanted Jack to punch him in the face when he was talking to him about Michael.

[norhoc]

I have heard several talking about a "cleaned up Zeke" walking by Claire and the baby in the end of this show. Anyone got a screen cap of it?

[Kate is sexy]

Yeah, his need to fix things is definately his tragic flaw. It's what makes him great, but it's always what drags him down in the end.

Still, the end of their marriage was both of their faults. Jack was busy with work and Sarah felt neglected, but she didn't tell him that. When they were in bed and Sarah told Jack about her negative pregnancy results, Jack wants to talk, but Sarah doesn't.

They didn't need Sarah cheating to tell the story, they stopped talking and became strangers, that's why their marriage ended. Sarah's who "I've been seeing someone else" line just feels like it was there to keep Jack likeable.

Maybe it's not. Maybe they'll use this as a basis for his next flashback. But at this point, I'm just hoping there won't be one. I remember thinking Jack's last flashback was really boring too.

Well it is both of their fault, but since Jack is a doctor is easy to understand why he focuses on his patients more than on his wife specially since his wife was once his patient. Its hard to forgive a wife cheating on a man just because she is lonely.
Its pretty obvious that Jack is the heor of the show and the writers will make him out to be as good as they can. Yeah I agree that his FB are not exciting like others, but I do like them and I guess thats because Jack is one of my favorite characters on the show. Yet I can basically predict whats going to happen in all his FB while I nver know whats going to happen for other characters.

[imaguestage]

Okay so this could be completely out there but I always thought the woman who jack's dad sliced through the hepatic artery was Jack's now ex-wife. He seemed to be okay covering up for dad until the pregnancy proclomation. Explains the random dicussion of her ( jack's wife )negative pregnancy test.

The woman that his dad operated on died.

[imaguestage]

I have heard several talking about a "cleaned up Zeke" walking by Claire and the baby in the end of this show. Anyone got a screen cap of it?

I thought that was Locke. That was when he called himself Uncle Johnny

[norhoc]

Locke was with claire and the baby. But several people have stated they thought they saw a cleaned up zeke walk by. Was looking for a scree ncap

[Maddy]

1) I thought for a moment tonight that perhaps Zeke's group of others might join up with Jack and company to fight an even greater evil--the others who kept killing the Tailies. I think Ethan and Goodwin were with the real evil others, and they are trying to take the children before Zeke gets to them first. Its just a power struggle over the children--not sure why.

2) I also agree that Locke's comment about "why you chose that name" was in reference to Mt. Vesuvious, not Sawyer or Mr. Clean.


3) Hurley is going to get some lovin'!

4) Did anyone else think the girl with the bag over her head was going to be Cindy?

5) Finally, my TV blacked out through a scene. I saw where Zeke showed himself. Then it went to commercial. The next thing I saw was the guns lowered and talk about the numbers of people. What happened in between????????

[imaguestage]

2) I also agree that Locke's comment about "why you chose that name" was in reference to Mt. Vesuvious, not Sawyer or Mr. Clean.




No, he was asking why he chose the name Saywer. Locke continued on to say he read the manifest and knows that Sawyer's real name is James Ford and that Sawyer was an interesting name to choose. He also asked where he got it from.

[Jinjur]

I rescend my earlier statement because if Desmond was with the captain and his group then they could have gotton the guns from him. I don't think they were able to get in that hatch at all. They merely knew of it's existence.

What you missed was the Captain telling Jack to light a fire and have a seat, that the island belonged to them, and how they were bieng bad houseguests, oh yeah and he started talking about humans and their insatiable curiosity.

I definatly think there is a race to get the children. Which side is good and which side is evil is something we have yet to learn. (white vs black)

[norhoc]

Anyone read that the producers have said that DHARMA is actually an anagram? Possibly---- Degroot Hanso Advanced Research Military Applications

[MaryUt]

Great episode for sure!

How did they know the babies name was Alex? If she was an infant when she was taken, she'd not have been able to tell them her name - but then again, how do they know Jack and Locke's name etc?

So Locke's questioning of Sawyer was interesting - kinda out of the blue - whee is that going?

Zeke = made me laugh, Sawyer has the best one lines (well he and Hurley).

I'm so glad the writers aren't hiding behind things - they showed us the smoke, now an other - very cool *shivers* - Season is NOT having a sophmore slump, which is way cool!!!

It took me a bit to realize that the actress playing Sarah had changed, then I found it distracting for some reason

Was she really seeing someone, I thought she was going to confess she was really pregnant, and hesitated, then says she's seeing someone else - something is not feeling right in that whole thing.

Next week, Aaron's in trouble - again - or was that just a tease???

[norhoc]

That wa sthe same actress playing Sarah--- Julie Bowen

[Maddy]

No, he was asking why he chose the name Saywer. Locke continued on to say he read the manifest and knows that Sawyer's real name is James Ford and that Sawyer was an interesting name to choose. He also asked where he got it from.

Well, that was what he SAID... but I don't think that was where he was originally going to go with that comment. That is what I meant to say--that Locke's comment was not about Sawyer's choice of a name. (Yes, I know he went on to explain how he knew Saywer's real name, but there is awkward tension there, like Locke was trying to hide something.)

[imaguestage]

Well, that was what he SAID... but I don't think that was where he was originally going to go with that comment. That is what I meant to say--that Locke's comment was not about Sawyer's choice of a name. (Yes, I know he went on to explain how he knew Saywer's real name, but there is awkward tension there, like Locke was trying to hide something.)

Okay, I see what you are saying. That's an interesting point. Goes along with the theory that Locke has been acting a bit odd this episode.

[Jinjur]

Locke has been acting a bit odd for awile now.

[Maddy]

Okay, I see what you are saying. That's an interesting point. Goes along with the theory that Locke has been acting a bit odd this episode.


Yes, but then again, asking about Sawyer's name is also odd. In general, I am starting to have my doubts about Locke. In this episode, he really started to bother me. Maybe he has the best of intentions, but he needs to be more articulate. He yells about Jack not being open minded about the island, but he has never tried to explain what he has seen.

Locke tells Jack to have "faith," but faith is a belief in that which is not seen. Locke has "seen" into the island, so what he has is not faith--he has a tanglible experience that has led him to where he is now, and asking Jack to have the same belief in the island (without the expereinces) is not really all that fair.

Wow--this turned into a Locke rant...

[Cees]

Hello, everyone--I've been reading for a few months but this is my first post.

I don't have anything astounding to add but wanted to say that I love the insight and theories. Also, I found this interesting blog entry while trying to research "Geronimo Jackson":
http://beggingtodiffer.com/
(click on "Continue reading Lost: The Hunt".)

I especially found the official LOST writers' podcast transcript very interesting.

I, too, would love a screenshot of what people are saying is the cleaned-up Zeke. Man, I do love Sawyer's nicknames! I never would've thought of that one for the bearded Other but the hillbilly-ish ness of it just fit so perfectly. Those writers do come up with some great dialogue.

[Phirun]

Remember this:

We now know there is an old WWII German Pistol(Which would bring up those ever so lovely Nazi theories that surfaced months ago) and an old US Army knife on the island.

Kind of makes you wonder... even with Hanso being an arms dealer.


The luger doesn't necessarily mean he is a nazi or has been there for a long time....its a pretty popular civillian weapon (or maybe his dad got it as a souvenier from the war).

[Lisa AR]

Found this on Geronimo Jackson.

You might want to keep your eyes peeled for Geronimo Jackson's audacious debut. They're a band not a lot of people have heard about. They just pressed one very obscure album in the mid to late 70s.


I found it here http://soquoted.blogspot.com/2006/01/new-lost-is-here-new-lost-is-here.html

[Lostraveler9]

The abscence of Jack's Tatoos was the FIRST thing I noticed!!!! And I feel that they were covered up directly because of the talk in this forum awhile back of the ABUNDANCE of Jack's tatoos, and how it was very unusual for a doctor to have tatoos in general and such prominent ones at that!!!
I have also noticed that since this forum discussed Jack's tatoos that Matthew Fox has been wearing SLEEVED shirts that cover the tatoos most of the time!!!!!!!

[mr. clean]

Locke was with claire and the baby. But several people have stated they thought they saw a cleaned up zeke walk by. Was looking for a scree ncap

Is it me, or did Zeke look like he was in disguise anyway. He looked like...Santa Claus...if he Santa was stuck on an island and kidnapped children.

[NOGOD]

I'm not buying that....I'd take an Iraqi soldier trained in torture techniques anyday over an LAPD cop....
sure the LAPD never torture anyone?

[Flik]

I don't know where the all the Jack-hating came from.

Let's analyze the facts:

Knock: Jack asking Ana-Lucia as opposed to Sayid for help "building an army".


Reason: Maybe Jack is a bit more comfortable talking to AL at this time as opposed to Sayid seeing as how he just buried his girlfriend.

Knock: Jack cheated on his ugly wife with a hot brunette.

Reason: He didn't bone her. He went home and explained it to his cheating wife.

Knock: Jack's a cry-baby.

Reason: He just shows his emotion instead of running off with loaded guns or getting shot and missing 1/2 a season at a time.

He's got the losties this far and I'm sure he'll continue to do so. Gorton is in for a surprise when Sayid, Sawyer, Locke, Ecko, Jin, and Jack show up for a brawl.

[lostsurvivor23]

Hmmm so who on the island will Sara have left Jack for?
and
I can not wait to see who Jack's wife is with ... does anyone think that it could be Desmond ? What a wild twist that would be ?

Interesting that you said that. That is the first thing I thought of when she said she had been seeing someone else. I too think Sarah will have left Jack for Desmond. Back at the beginning of the season I swore the picture in the hatch of Desmond and the girl looked like Jack's wife, Sarah. I guess we will have to wait and see.

Great episode. Best yet this season by far!

[DuchsLove]

Gorton is in for a surprise when Sayid, Sawyer, Locke, Ecko, Jin, and Jack show up for a brawl.

I wonder/doubt if Locke and Eko will join up with Jack, or if that will be part of the "Lord of the Flies" split.

[*Saint*]

Back to the beginning of the show: I squealed in delight when I saw M.C. Gainey's name in the credits. I knew for sure that "This is Our Island," was said by him in the trailer...those of us that agreed, were right!

I love Kate, but she totally messed up tonight. I wish, however, Jack asked a FEW more questions before he got Kate back. She'd eventually understand. I wonder if she saw anything (or even heard anything) interesting when taken by "the Others." Will we find that out? Or are we doomed to speculate for evermore??

I don't get the Zeke reference either...Loved the Daniel Boone and Mr. Clean references by Sawyer, though...

Michael is losing it... Kind of puts in perspective why some marriages are broken up after a child is kidnapped. I think he has definately lost it.

"Build an army?" Wow. Didn't see that coming! Even AFTER reading Matthew Fox's interview in TV Guide about the Lord of The Flies direction, I never imagined he would say anything like that...

Where was Sayid through most of this episode? Interesting choice to leave him out...

And why leave Mr. Eko out of building the army too? After all, he has killed his share...wait until they find that out!!!!

Great episode!!! Again, I am itching for the next one!!!!:Cowdance:

[I Hate Seabillies]

Could be the test subjects vs. the people who were running the tests. :)

I like the idea. who are the testors? Zeke and his pyros? Who are the subjects? Ethan/Goodwin and the roaming body snatchers?

Whoever the testors are, wouldn't they have known of the hatch Desmond was in? or the hatch the tailies found?

[Lostraveler9]

:mad: :pissed: An observation I have noticed......it seems to me that a few things that go on in the show is directly from talk that goes on here in the forums!

Tonight we heard Jack mentioning Ethan to Capt. Gorton, clear out of the blue! Ethan's name has not been mentioned since season one! A new viewer to this show and tonight's episode would have no idea who Ethan was!

The tattoo reference Chopped Boccoli and I mentioned earlier, I feel was directly in response to our discussion of it in this forum.

As an older viewer, but one that is very sharp to pick up on hidden ideas and meaning in TV shows and in Movies, I'm a bit annoyed that I would have never picked up on the continuity of the story line if I had not been apart of this forum.

All the references to Alvar Hanso, and the Dharma Initiative is LOST to the TV audience if they do no follow the forums.

It just seems to me that the TV viewer cannot get the full impact and enjoyment of the show if he/she does NOT follow the internet forums.

And just to restate, I feel alot of plot material is written around what is discussed in these forums! I rest my case!

[pilot3033]

I was just wondering about Vincent the Dog. I know weird things happen when people take care of him, but he must serve some sort of greater metaphore that we can't see. I'd not be surprised to find out the dog is aprt of the larger consipricy (should there be one).
Any thoughts? Lots of foreshadow in this epsisode.

EDIT:
Losttraveler9: I agree. I did not pick up any of the big picture stuff until recently. However, eventually I think it will all come to light. It just adds to the mystery and enjoyment of the show for those who do follow. Two routes to the answer, but in the end, every one will meet at the same place.

[DuchsLove]

Lostraveler9, ITA. If I did not read these forums when I have a free minute I would be completely confused and know a lot less than I do.

[Jinjur]

AS: -Sayid was left out of the episode because he would have immediatly noticed that Alex was Danielle's Daughter.

-Zeke was just a nickname Sawer gave him, just like all the other nicknames he gives.

on a side note-I am betting that Desmond got with Jack's wife and I'm guessing that she was pregnant.

IMO

[*Saint*]

I am totally cool when it comes to everything else but LOST. Then I become a total "geek."

And you know what?

I love it. I'm not afraid to admit it.

I love checking these forums. It's interactive and allows me to catch things that I wouldn't have otherwise noticed.

Thank GOD, JJ, Damon and Carlton are as big of GEEKS as the rest of us. They know how we think and what we want.

Now THAT is what I call GOOD TV!!!

[Jinjur]

Hear Hear! LOL At least were not addicted to a lame show...it could be much worse:)

[*Saint*]

Yeah...

...like Invasion.


LOL!!!!:p

[Lostraveler9]

.......and another thing... did you remember tonight Sawyer's remark that "Cindy was taken by the Others". That was siad merely for OUR benefit, so we would know once and forall what happened to her. The TV audience I'm SURE had no idea who he was refering to. We all remember Cindy as the Aussie stewardess who seemed to have sliped away while our heros were climbing up the embankment.

And also, why would Locke bring up the subject of Sawyer's real name right when they are climbing/moving in a a "hunt" and not while they are just sitting on the beach shooting the breeze. That seemed like an odd time to bring it up!
I also agree with what was said earlier........ why of all ppl does Gung Ho Jack take a recently badly wounded Sawyer on his hunt, and a just clobbered over the head Locke with him on the hunt. If I were him, I would have definately asked Mr. Eko, and Sayid to go instead. Granted poor Sayid is very depressed because of Shannon's death, but still, Locke and Sawyer were bad choices.

Also has anyone EVER bought up the question of how Dr. Jack is so skilled in the use of guns???????

Also the original actress that played Sarah is not the same actress who played Sarah tonight!

BTW, I'm starting to REALLY dislike Jack ALOT. and it would serve him right if the guy Sarah was "seeing" was infact "Brotha" Desmond!

[*Saint*]

Also the original actress that played Sarah is not the same actress who played Sarah tonight!


Yeah it is. She just darkened her blonde hair a little.

Last season it was played by Julie Bowen (formerly of "ed" and now "Boston Legal") and tonight it was...Julie Bowen.

Don't know who you are thinking of...

[wharf rat]

Pretty good episode. So "Walt is a special boy"? Maybe the "others" are nabbing all the kids so they can (eventually) build up their community again (with new babies? - the kids will get older fast snf...). Maybe the "others" have all been made sterile by whatever contaminated the island? And it is way too hard to nab adults and say "breed". ?? Just thinking crazy now...

And I don't think I want Ana Lucia in MY army!

[DuchsLove]

And also, why would Locke bring up the subject of Sawyer's real name right when they are climbing/moving in a a "hunt" and not while they are just sitting on the beach shooting the breeze. That seemed like an odd time to bring it up!

I agree that it seemed odd, but then again Locke seems to bring things up at odd times. I think we might be seeing the beginning of a "connection" between Sawyer and Locke. (I have my theory as to what that connection is..but I'll keep that to myself for now.)

[kevgrass]

Locke's role in the encounter was intriguing. First he seemed to sense something was about to happen when he tried to convince Jack to turn around. And during the interaction, he seemed to be just an observer.

Locke may have some connection to this group. Remember, he took a liking to Walk in the beginning of the series. He obviously played a part in Michael running off today by teaching him how to use a gun.

[kevgrass]

Screen Cap of "Zeke" in camp at the end of the episode?

[Badger]

"How long do you think it will take to train an army?"

Well i'll be dipped in dung but somebody got a clue. See what happens when 'a few of our survivors grab some guns, get angry and storm off on a wild goose chase', to paraphrase an unnamed poster. They lose 4 weapons they can't afford to lose!

Badger said:

Go ahead, arm yourself to the teeth and take on an unknown force with all the other unknowns I mentioned in my post earlier in this thread and good luck. In reality that would be foolish. But, once again, this is TV and that is probably just what they will do.

and:

They cannot afford to be captured, let alone with weapons. They have a limited number of weapons and ammo and therefore they need use them only when necessary.

They need to be cautious and insure their weapons do not fall into the hands of the Others for this reason.

How prophetic.

[Kostamojen]

Yeah...

...like Invasion.


LOL!!!!:p
You know the ironic thing is that both episodes of Lost and Invasion tonight showed the beginings of a big conflict coming :p

Anyway, tonights episode needed a better backstory... I don't think it helped explain why Jack went up the hill (hehe) well enough for me. It was good to see what happened to Jack but I think we needed to see more of what was going on with Michael this episode rather than Jack...

I did like seeing the others. However, I think I would have tried to get them to reveal how many weapons they had before I gave them up (maybe cock the rifle to listen if any of the Others cocked the rifles too). I think loosing those AK's and 9m's was a bad thing for the losties... It puts them at a serious disadvantage.

I do hope that maybe they wise up and start creating a perimeter around the camp and maybe even relocate everyone underground and setup defences while "training the army". The others just walk right into the camp way too easy...

IBRedDawn

[Iorhael]

I've read through about half so far...I am on the west coast, and on top of the watched the show an hour later tonight so am playing catch up here...here are my comments so far:

Pieces of Artz: did Jack go to AL to ask about an army? It seems like Sayid might be more useful in that area.

Logically Sayid would be...but I think Jack was feeling rejected by Kate (because of Sawyer...not to mention memories of Sarah) so he sought out AL.

Challena: how did sawyer know the "other" (grizzly adams dude) was named Zeeck?

I thinks that's just another one of Sawyer's nick names ;)

Chinamom: Don’t you think Zeke’s response to Jack about Ethan being a spy (“Well that’s an interesting theory”) was for all of us who have wondered the same thing?

Yes! :) I thought so too!

----------

And something my hubby brought up about the extended absence of Desmond and Danielle...perhaps they are hanging out together? ;o!

And perhaps the real reason Jack didn't want Kate along was because of her "connection" with Sawyer, and the ill-fated kiss, so she brings back to-familiar memories of Sarah's rejection.

[DJJT300]

Could "Zeke" be short for Ezekiel - from the Bible?

I found this page on the net:

http://www.biblenotes.net/ezekiel.html

[MonkeyNextDoor]

I think that Jack going to AL was in part that she had experiance with the others, and their style of fighting. And in part, that she has no other links to people on the island right now. Jack can feel free to discuss anything with her and know that she won't go talking to anyone else about it.

Also about the Kate thing, he probably sees a possibility that she could cheat on him as well. Think of Sawyer there.

You all bringing up Desmond with Jack's wife, reminded me of the scene when Jack is confronting Desmond in the hatch. Desmond brings up Jack's wife, and wants to know what happened to her.

[Evilrabbit]

Great episode!

The scene with Hurley and Charlie discussing women had me laughing ahrder than anything else in the entire series! I read spoilers about Hurley and Libby (i.e. Hubby or Hurbby) but seeing it on the actual show was awesome!

That part with the bearded man in the Jungle was super intense. Now there's a plotline that really went somewhere, not like in ...and Found when Michael just ran off into the jungle but Jin brought him back and that went nowhere.

ALEX IS ALIVE!! Woot! I wonder how they know that's her name? Probably the same way they know John and Jack's names. Or maybe Danielle was screaming "Don't take my Alex!" or something when they took her. Are Zach, Emma, and Walt also with them? Would Aaron be if Claire hadn't escaped?

I'm surprised, I read through this whole thread and I was sure I'd find some reference to "Jack and John need to come out of the closet" at the beginning, but I guess I'm the only one who'd come up with something as stupid as that.

Jack and his wife-average backstory. I was a bit unclear about how this parallels what's happening on the island now (usually it's alot more obvious), but him talking to Gabriella about whether they should "turn back" and not do the surgery is like when he was arguing with Locke about whether to literally turn back. And his dad warned him about crossing a line, which I think was getting too emotionally involved with patients and families, which is what caused his marriage to fall apart (which is weird because Sarah was a patient too.) Also, on the island, Mr. Friendly tells him he can't cross a line, or once again something bad will happen to a woman. (kate) Also it explains why Jack is having trouble in his relationship with Kate, because he's probably paranoid about women cheating on him, and he knows that she and Sawyer have this thing going on. For those of you who think that Sarah was dating Desmond, here is what I posted at Lost-Media about that. Sorry if it's confusing.

Okay, just in terms of the timeline, there is no way Sarah was seeing Desmond, because Shannon was 18 when her dad died, which is when Sarah was in her accuident, and she's 20 on the island so that was about 2 years ago. And Sarah says at the wedding that her accident was two years ago. So I guess Shannon had just turned 18 in her flashback and was almost 21 on the island, so it's like 2 years and 9 months or whatever, so Jack and Sarah have been married for 9 months (or something less than a year) before the crash. And Desmond has been on the island for about 3 years (which makes sense assuming he got there very shortly after meeting Jack in the stadium, and it wasn't exactly 3 years. So Desmond was on the island during that window of opportunity.


I'm really proud of Jin for staying with his wife. He has shown tremendous growth from when he was a conservative overly dominating husband. Now he's welcoming Ana with fish, and listening to his wife when she complains about being told what to do, and decides to stay with her.

Awesome episode and can't wait till next week!

[t0x]

Could "Zeke" be short for Ezekiel - from the Bible?Could "Mr. Clean" refer to this passage in the bible?

"And thou shalt useth Mr. Clean, for thou art Stronger Than Dirt".

[ate_won_5]

Ok I understand that Kate had a gun to her head and time was running out, but why did they not ask more questions?

After Zeke said "this is our island" I would've been like "Ok well thanks for lettin' us stay here. Now how the hell do we get back home??"

[Iorhael]

lilmeezer: Is this what Jack said to Ana Lucia at the end of the episode?

He says "Do you think you could help train an Army?" (or something close to that).

Choppin' Broccoli: Michael says the computer isn't what everyone thinks it is. What does Michael know about the computer?

Yes...interesting line...especially when combined with Jack's line early in the season about "the last time he saw a computer that could save the world, this was not it."

bhambulldog:: I can not wait to see who Jack's wife is with ... does anyone think that it could be Desmond ? What a wild twist that would be ?

I remember some people saying that the picture of the gal with Desmond in the hatch looked like Sarah...interesting possibility...

-----------------
And a question....was the Jack flashback taking place before or after the showdown with his father about the drinking during surgery? I couldn't tell.

And a rhetorical question (though if anyone has a response I'd love to hear it)...why was Locke so darned quiet during the confrontation with Zeke ....it looked like he was just bursting to say something...I guess he's torn between his loyalty to his fellow survivors and his faith in the Island.

[LoStMyMiNd]

I wonder why Zeke didn't ask Locke for his knife.

Also does anyone have a screen cap of all the people who lite up around them. The scene moved too fast for me to count the lights

[merry slug]

Jack went to Ana because he's upset over how he feels about Kate.

I second that. He's moving away from Kate and towards AL. I go the feeling that he was just bouncing the idea off her, too.

[CLUCK]

So now that we got the outstayed our welcome houseguest speech - what does that make Desmond? They seemed to have tolerated him fairly well for 3 years.

because desmond stayed in the hatch and pressed the button and didn't bother anyone... the losties are out looking for whatever may be roaming the island, and "zeke" isn't cool with that.

i am still wondering why they wouldnt ask "zeke" questions about who they are and why they are there.

hurley's comment about libby was priceless... "shes hot, in that "terrorized by others for 40 days" kind of way!"

hurley rocks!

[merry slug]

I remember some people saying that the picture of the gal with Desmond in the hatch looked like Sarah...interesting possibility...


I think this would make a very interesting plot twist, BUT, I think Jack would've noticed by now that a picture of Sarah was in the hatch. Unless Desmond took the picture with him?

[truffula]

"From the dawn of our species, Man has been blessed with curiosity"

When I post my notes from this episode later tonight, yal will be BLOWN AWAY.
Trust me. ;)

Peace,
Truff

[Loveriot]

I hope Sayid "builds up" his own army!

I understand what you are saying...but to me, it just doesn't make any sense at all for Jack to ask Ana about training an army just because she was a cop...he knows how highly skilled Sayid is when it comes to the army and military...it just didn't sit well with me that he asked her over him...after all, Sayid has already been with him for 50 days on the island, he knows him and trusts him...Ana, he barely knows, yet he goes to her? Doesn't make any sense to me.

I agree with you. Hopefully, he was intending to include Sayid, but is assuming he is in mourning at this moment. I did find it strange when Sayid finds out about the hunting party from Charlie and Hurley.