View Full Version : After "The 23rd Psalm": "Worse" or "Was" ?
Chinamom
01-18-06, 03:51 PM
When Michael asked Eko if he was married, there was debate about Eko's response ("Worse" or "Was") and I don't think it was ever resolved? So after seeing his flashback are there any more thoughts about his answer? "Worse" doesn't really make sense--being kidnapped and forced to tote a gun, kill people, and move drugs is worse than being married? (OK, I mean it IS, but that's a really odd comparison). Or just simply, he WAS married and we haven't seen that flashback yet?
What do you think?
Hodgepodge
01-18-06, 04:54 PM
Chinamom, prior to The 23rd Psalm, I'd assumed from that statement, Mr. Eko praticed polygamy. Taking into consideration he was probably from Africa. But now I don't know! I guess it might still be a possibility, but I get the impression he was to busy with other things.
azteclady
01-18-06, 07:36 PM
He was from Africa, but from an openly Catholic village. My first instinct would be to say that no, no way he would practice polygamy being a Catholic. However, he was kindapped and thrust into a life of crime rather early on, so all bets would be off regarding his behavious toward women after such a traumatic experience and evidently violent youth.
longlostluvr
01-20-06, 12:41 PM
[quote=Chinamom]
When Michael asked Eko if he was married, there was debate about Eko's response ("Worse" or "Was") and I don't think it was ever resolved? So after seeing his flashback are there any more thoughts about his answer? "Worse" doesn't really make sense--being kidnapped and forced to tote a gun, kill people, and move drugs is worse than being married? (OK, I mean it IS, but that's a really odd comparison). Or just simply, he WAS married and we haven't seen that flashback yet? What do you think?
OMG! After spending way-way-way to much time on these boards
I cannot believe I missed the whole "worse" or "was" debate!
In the past I admit that I have misquoted Mr. Eko largely because of the old language barrier issue. AAA is of Nigerian descent, but was raised in London. Throw in some English; "American-style" and you get a pretty complicated dialect, I think! Now I get it! He absolutely had to have said "was." Up until now I had still mentally wrestled with the meaning of his "worse" response. It made no sense at all even from a religious standpoint.
From a Catholic-religious standpoint, I'd have to go with him saying "worse."
There are seven sacraments (from memory):
Baptism
Penance
Communion
Confirmation
Marriage
Ordination
Last Rites
Typically, Ordination (becoming a priest/nun) is an alternative to Marriage. I know that he isn't technically a priest, but I think that's besides the point.
So, perhaps in Eko's mind, being a priest is "worse" than being married.
longlostluvr
01-20-06, 08:14 PM
[quote-DohBoy]
From a Catholic-religious standpoint, I'd have to go with him saying "worse."
Typically, Ordination (becoming a priest/nun) is an alternative to Marriage. I know that he isn't technically a priest, but I think that's besides the point.
So, perhaps in Eko's mind, being a priest is "worse" than being married.
Color me ignorant, but generally speaking, aren't men of the cloth both respected and revered? Isn't their work considered profoundly honorable? I'm confused. :confused:
^ dunno. Depends, I guess. I've never been a priest or a nun. Never considered becoming one. That whole celibacy thing is quite a drag. I've known a lot of priests and nuns, and generally I've respected them. Are you planning on becoming a priest or nun?
If Eko did say "worse," and was referencing the fact that he was a priest, as in: "You married?" "Worse - I was a priest," then Eko was probably being tongue-in-cheek. I doubt Eko would disparage the priesthood.
Or just simply, he WAS married and we haven't seen that flashback yet?
What do you think?
Total speculation, but I think he was married. In my totally speculative imagination he lost her in some way that makes him feel guilty. So, losing his wife is worse than being married.
azteclady
01-21-06, 02:26 PM
I am thinking that he may have been married by common law (i.e., living with someone, maybe even having fathered children by her?), but that after taking on Yemi's identity he may not have been able to go back to her and his family. That is a way of 'losing' her that would be guaranteed to make Eko feel guilty now that he's back on the path of righteousness.
longlostluvr
01-21-06, 06:39 PM
[quote-DohBoy]
dunno. Depends, I guess. I've never been a priest or a nun. Never considered becoming one. That whole celibacy thing is quite a drag. I've known a lot of priests and nuns, and generally I've respected them. Are you planning on becoming a priest or nun?
If Eko did say "worse," and was referencing the fact that he was a priest, as in: "You married?" "Worse - I was a priest," then Eko was probably being tongue-in-cheek. I doubt Eko would disparage the priesthood.
I, too, doubt Eko would disparge the priesthood. However, I'm still not totally getting "worse" as his response, but I'm probably wrong. :confused:
I know that this and other issues can be debated for weeks, but for now I'll just wait for the paperback version "LOST Scripts for Dummies."
P.S. I am not planning on becoming a priest or nun (the latter in my case). For now, I'm content in my career as an elementary schoolteacher.
but that after taking on Yemi's identity he may not have been able to go back to her and his family. That is a way of 'losing' her that would be guaranteed to make Eko feel guilty now that he's back on the path of righteousness.
I like that idea. I was thinking the pregnant woman image that the monster sees might be his wife.
Fish1941
01-23-06, 05:28 PM
When Michael asked Eko if he was married, there was debate about Eko's response ("Worse" or "Was") and I don't think it was ever resolved? So after seeing his flashback are there any more thoughts about his answer? "Worse" doesn't really make sense--being kidnapped and forced to tote a gun, kill people, and move drugs is worse than being married? (OK, I mean it IS, but that's a really odd comparison). Or just simply, he WAS married and we haven't seen that flashback yet?
What do you think?
It was Jin who had asked Eko if he was married, not Michael.:rolleyez:
Also, if you check out the Black Smoke scene with Eko, one of the images in the smoke was that of a woman.
Hodgepodge
01-23-06, 11:13 PM
It was Jin...Also, if you check out the Black Smoke scene with Eko, one of the images in the smoke was that of a woman.I thought that was an image of the woman selling the "Virgin Mary" statues out front of the church?
azteclady
01-23-06, 11:27 PM
I know that someone posted screen caps of the images seeing in smokey while it stood in front of Eko (notice how I'm not getting into the debate as to whether Eko was projecting, or smokey was scanning? ;) ) I'll try to find them and link that post here.
Here are some screencaps:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v235/spookysee/th_WomanSellingStatues.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v235/spookysee/WomanSellingStatues.jpg) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v235/spookysee/th_WomanInConfessional.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v235/spookysee/WomanInConfessional.jpg) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v235/spookysee/th_WomanInChurch2.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v235/spookysee/WomanInChurch2.jpg) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v235/spookysee/th_WomanInChurch1.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v235/spookysee/WomanInChurch1.jpg) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v235/spookysee/th_ekoVsMonsterWoman2.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v235/spookysee/ekoVsMonsterWoman2.jpg) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v235/spookysee/th_ekoVsMonsterWoman.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v235/spookysee/ekoVsMonsterWoman.jpg)
It looks to me like the women in the monster POV aren't anyone we saw in Eko's FB, which makes think those "pictures" are from memories we haven't seen yet, which makes me speculate one of them is his wife (presumably the pretty one). For all I know they could be random people from another scene, but his "worse" comment leads to wild speculation on my part. :D
Hodgepodge
01-24-06, 04:46 PM
...It looks to me like the women in the monster POV aren't anyone we saw in Eko's FB, which makes think those "pictures" are from memories we haven't seen yet, which makes me speculate one of them is his wife (presumably the pretty one). For all I know they could be random people from another scene, but his "worse" comment leads to wild speculation on my part. :DI see now! It wasn't the same woman.
But that leads to the questions, how is "Smokey" gettting this information? How does the mind-meld work? Time to read the transcripts of Orientation again. What was the Dharma Intiative working on?
azteclady
01-24-06, 04:58 PM
I am firmly in the 'smokey scanned Eko's mind' camp! This would also help explain some of Locke's visions and actions, I think. If Locke was scanned that first time (when he goes after the boar alone after Micheal is gored, and Kate helps him back to the beach), maybe whatever smokey is is also capable of making subliminal / subconscious suggestions to those it has scanned (i.e., Locke's dreaming about the Beechcraft).
Hodge, one of the things the Dharma Initiative was working on was parapsychology, which includes telepathy, clairvoyance, telekinesis, and astral projection, among other things.
Chinamom
01-25-06, 02:16 PM
Thanks for your thoughts, everyone! I guess we still don't have a resolution to the "Worse" vs. "Was" dilemma. Rats.
I guess the answer to my question might be a spoiler to some, but does anyone know if there are more Eko flashbacks planned for this season? Use the spoiler-hiding thingy please.
I guess the answer to my question might be a spoiler to some, but does anyone know if there are more Eko flashbacks planned for this season? Use the spoiler-hiding thingy please.
Chinamom,
But I didn't see any of the future episodes as relating to Eko. However, they (epi descriptions) only run about 4 or 5 episodes ahead so it's still a possibility.
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