Did he or didn't he lie to Danielle?

[moonshadow707]

People are talking about this here and there... I think it needs its own thread.
I don't understand why some are saying "Why did he lie to Danielle about Nadia being dead?"
I don't believe he WAS lying. Yes, the CIA agent told him she was living in Irvine, but there was at least another day before he got on the ill-fated flight to LA. It's been theorized that maybe the terrorist network killed her in that interim for revenge against Sayid. Or maybe the CIA had her killed. Or maybe she just met with an unfortunate accident. OR perhaps the CIA just flat-out lied to him about knowing her whereabouts in the first place, in order to get him to cooperate with them.
We know that he was pulled out of line at the Sydney airport. Was it racial profiling, or did they have him pulled out of line to give him some last-minute info about Nadia?
I don't know which of these theories I believe... I don't even know if I think Nadia is dead or alive. I'm not sure that the writers have even made up their minds about this.

But I DO think that when Sayid told Danielle "She's dead", he believed it. I don't think he was lying because I cannot think of a reason why he would then add: "Because of me."
At that point, he wa still tied up to the shockbed and Danielle had been accusing him of lying. If he WAS lying, why add more to the story than he needed to? She could have pushed him for more info, and if she then realized he was making it up on the spot - well, why risk making Danielle angry? (Wrong answer! ZZZZT! Ow ow STOP!)
She had NOT yet told him that her lover, Robert, was part of the research team who had died, so it's not like he was trying to make that connection: "Hey, we both lost someone we cared about."
Even if it was a case of him "giving up" and deciding to accept that Nadia might be dead, there's still no reason for that line: "Because of me."
It was because of him that she was not executed at the prison. Because of him, she lived at least a while longer.

So whether or not Nadia is actually dead, I believe that he was TOLD that she was.

I'd like to know what you all think about this. Who knows, maybe someone can change my mind.

[Mattie]

I don't think he lied. And I don't think it's a plot hole either. I think it will explained, eventually, what happened to Nadia.

[kadeskiss]

I don't think he lied. And I don't think it's a plot hole either. I think it will explained, eventually, what happened to Nadia

wasn't Nadia at first in "Sidney? and than he went to L.A to find her? I do not recall her suppose to be dead, because if she was, what reason would he had to be going to L.A.?

[Hodgepodge]

I'm transposing this from, The Greater Good episode discussion thread.

Solitary, is the episode Sayid tells Danielle she's dead. It's also episode 9, of ABC 13 episode commitment. Coming back 12 episodes later, TPTB may've wanted to change where Sayid's back-story was going. Also, wouldn't it be ironic, if they start showing front-stories, of our survivors friends and relatives, to show Nadia. Maybe she found out from the CIA agent that Sayid was on his way to her, or that he perished in the crash of flight 815. Either way, I know I'd have to find a box of Kleenex to wipe my tears.

[Cassis1]

I think he lied.

As you point out, at that moment Sayid was helpless and at Danielle's mercy. He had no reason to believe she wouldn't kill him the minute she got bored or a little crazier. The only option he had--and he would know this from being on the other side of the fence--would be to make a connection with her, make her see him as a human being. To make her interested. So he told her an interesting fact, started a story. It's an age-old tactic (see The Thousand and One Nights). While Sayid didn't know then about Danielle and Robert, he did know that she had been alone for a long time and that she was rather desperately looking for someone (Alex). So a tragic story might appeal to her.

I think the anguish in his voice was honest. Because he had, at this point, lost Nadia probably for good after seven years--if not because he learned something more before he got on the plane (which I think is likely) then because he's stranded on mystery frickin' island and about to die. :)

Later, after Sayid had started to feel a real connection to Danielle, he told her the truth: that he had hung on for seven years to a blind hope that Nadia was alive. Probably at the time it didn't seem relevant to add "And she's married with 2.4 kids living in a suburb of Los Angeles." ;)

[azteclady]

I honestly don't remember where I read the basic idea, but it does make some sense to me, which is why I'm bringing it up here.

In The Greater Good, between the end of the CIA operation in Sydney, and the Oceanic Flight 815, Sayid stayed an extra day to be able to claim his friend's body and give it proper burial.

There's a significance to that - first, there's the fact that by changing his flight Sayid ends up one of our doomed survivors. Second, it provides a window of time for something to happen to Nadia.

Sawyer states with utter conviction that Sayid was pulled to the side right before boarding, and this (and Sayid's ethnicity) are the basis for Sawyer's conviction that Sayid was the prisoner to whom the handcuffs belonged. What if Sayid was indeed pulled to the side by officials, but not for racial profiling (since he had probably been already vetted by the CIA and Australian intelligence) but to tell him something about Nadia.

This could also explain Sayid's earlier overwhelming urgency to escape the island, why he was so adamant about finding the transmission's source - his urgency might have been fueled by events occurring in Los Angeles.

So he may have been telling Danielly Rousseau the truth, as he knew it at the time.

[ThatHippieKid]

are the basis for Sawyer's conviction that Sayid was the prisoner to whom the handcuffs belonged.

Wasn't it the other way around? Sayid accused Sawyer of being the prisoner in the second pilot part, I remember. I don't remember Sawyer accusing Sayid of being anything but a terrorist, but I could be wrong. I havent watched the pilots in a while.

[azteclady]

I'll have to check spooky's awesome LOST Transcripts (http://www.lost-tv.com/transcripts/) before I can be utterly sure, but my memory is that Sawyer accused Sayid first, and that then Sayid turned it on Sawyer.

Update: checked the transcript, this is the pertinent part:

[Fight between Sawyer and Sayid on the beach. People standing around watching.]
Michael -Hey guys, c'mon.
Jack -Hey, break it up. Break it up.
[Some words said between Sayid and Sawyer.]
Sayid -Tell everyone what you told me. Tell them that I crashed the plane. Go on, tell them:
Sawyer -The shoe fits, buddy.
Jack -What is going on?
[More words between Sawyer and Sayid (I can't really understand.)]
Michael (handing the handcuffs to Jack) -My kid found these in the jungle.
Sawyer -This guy was sitting in the back row of business class the whole flight, never got up. Hands folded underneath a blanket. And for some reason, just pointing this out, the guy I saw next to him didn't make it.
Sayid -Thank you so much for observing my behavior.
Sawyer -You don't think I saw them pull you out of line before we boarded.
[Sayid's trying to get to Sawyer again, to hit him.]
Sawyer -Bring it.
Kate -Stop.
[Sayid backs off.]

So... what I said. ;)

[moonshadow707]

Hodgepodge - I'm not quite sure if you're saying yes he did, no he didn't, maybe or don't know. (I might be dense, though.) But I love that you're such a softy about Nadia and Sayid.:) If TPTB want to change the direction of his backstory, that's fine... they can't just expect us to forget about words the character said earlier. They'd better have a plausible explanation.

Cassis1 - nope, I'm still not convinced. He definitely was trying to make a connection with her later - offering to fix her musicbox, asking for her first name... but I'm not sure that he was quite on his game yet when he answered the question about Nadia. It seemed very genuine to me. Most of all, that "because of me" line is the real sticking point for me. He could have played the sympathy card without blaming himself.
When he later said "The more I hold on, the more I pull away from those around me", it seems like he's contradicting his earlier statement because he's using the present tense. But not if what he's holding onto is no longer the hope that she's alive, but the memory of her.

azteclady - sounds like we agree. I think he was pulled out of line to be given some new info about Nadia, and that he believed she was dead when he said that to Danielle.

When I said that maybe the writers don't know yet if Nadia is dead or alive, I meant they could be allowing themselves some wiggle room by just having Sayid being told that she's dead, but it could be either a lie or "bad intelligence".

We may find out what happened soon enough. Or not.

[Hodgepodge]

moonshadow707 says:Hodgepodge - I'm not quite sure if you're saying yes he did, no he didn't, maybe or don't know. (I might be dense, though.) But I love that you're such a softy about Nadia and Sayid. If TPTB want to change the direction of his backstory, that's fine... they can't just expect us to forget about words the character said earlier. They'd better have a plausible explanation...Moonshadow707, I think it was a non-issue until we started discussing the problem. And I agree, now TPTB will have to come up with some type of explanation. But, I don't think they thought we'd catch it.

[mzsandeestar]

Isn't it possible that in that last day , Sayid was given the information to contact Nadia. When he attempts to contact her he finds out that she has just recently died. He asks for an explanation from the CIA and that is why he is pulled out of line so they can give him the information that the terrorists got to Nadia when they found out what Sayid did?