Scott's Injuries

[Air91]

Can someone post what is said about the list of injuries to Scott? I know that they said he had a broken neck and all the bones in his hands were broken.....and more broken bones?

Doesn't this seem like a lot of injuries for Ethan to inflict on Scott? Just hitting hit a few times or sneaking up on him and breaking his neck wouldn't lead to all those broken bones.

The only way someone could break all those bones that I could think of would be a fall from a great height (from an airplane crash or from the monster's claws as it flys). How about this twist on a theory.....Scott (and everyone else) was already dead, Ethan simply used his power to make Scott realize the truth.

[lungcandy]

i think she said his neck and every bone in both arms and hands were broken.

[Maybishudbahippy]

I think he did this just to make his point. That he would really kill someone every day unless Claire is returned to him.

[Air91]

It just seems odd that he could do all that to Scott and not even give Jack a fat lip or a broken nose.

Maybe he used all his strength to crack Scott's body into dust :)

[immuneman]

i agree. i think he broke scotts arms, fingers and neck to emphasize that he will not only kill but make it as painfull as possible. i might agree with falling or being ravaged by the monster if the broken bones werent so selective...

[lostinchitown]

Scott was wet, too. My first thought was that his injuries were a result of the plane crash - not Ethan. How this is possible - I don't know. Just an instinct.

[JacksGirlfriend]

Personally I think something else got Scott.

For one thing, Scott never screamed. No one heard anything. A man does not have his arm and fingers broken without screaming.

Let's say Ethan killed him first... now, exactly what is the point of mutilating a man like that after he's dead? To prove you'll do it? You don't need to do that - you've already proven you have the strength and determination to kill.

No... my instinct tell me it was something or someone else.

[loseme]

It is possible that he died from other causes, and the rocks in the ocean broke some of the other bones?

[JacksGirlfriend]

Yes, I suppose that's possible, but frankly the area around the beach doesn't seem to be strewn with many rocks, at least not that I've noticed.

I think he was definitely killed, but not by Ethan.

[LoStMyMiNd]

We didn't see Ethan kill Scott, therefore, we have no information that Ethan killed Scott. Also I think that Scott was killed somewhere else and placed there on the beach by the person or thing that killed him. And yes, his injuries could have been caused by the plane crash, to add sort of an esoteric twist to it. Maybe he was a allusion. Maybe he was actually dead and everyone else thought he was alive.

[Bungarian]

I think Ethen killed him then broke all those bones to scare the others. He could break them with a stone or whatever after he was dead.

[drabauer]

OK, here's a theory: when killing needs to be done, Ethan sends a "monster" or lackey. But he wouldn't trust anyone else to bring Claire back without hurting her, so he came himself.

Or: he broke Scott's neck first, then broke the other bones at his leisure, to send a message.

Or: he brought a crowbar with him (read Spooky's great post on the importance of beatings with pipes (http://p073.ezboard.com/flosttheunofficalforumfortheabcseriesfrm29.showMes sage?topicID=1132.topic) among other running themes.

[azteclady]

And let's not forget: we don't know from where Ethan took Scott - we seem to be assuming that Scott was stationed somewhere around the beach camp.

I believe that Ethan dragged Scott from the perimeter, killed him on the beach away from the camp, broke Scott's bones at his leisure, then dragged the body to the beach camp from the sea. That way no one hears anything, and Ethan doesn't actully have to carry dead weight.

As to why Ethan broke Scott's bones, I would say that it was a form of psychological warfare, if you will. What Ethan is telling all of the other survivors is, "I will not only kill you, but I can make is as painful as hell."



Beto
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[OhioSteve1]

I read a thread last month whose author had similar beliefs. I will summarize them for you, because you are new.

This person argued that the entire show takes place over about 20 seconds while the plane is crashing. When the monster kills someone, they are actually dying in the plane crash. That's why (according to this theorist) the monster is invisible and makes mechanical sounds. That's also why Rose says that the monster's sounds are "familiar". The vast majority of the show is the characters' subconscious attempts to resolve issues in their life before they die.

Its a purgatory-esque theory.

[yung23]

I think he simply walked up out of the water at night,
and grabbed scott karate style, bending his fingers back on
both hands at once, forcing scott to his knees,
it's a pressure point kind of hold.
Going that extra bit of pressure to break his hand bones
wouldn't have been hard for Ethan, it seems,
and the resulting pain may have put Scott into shock
( more of a gasp than a scream ),
just long enough to snap his neck.

Ethan was trained to fight somehow.

[jcrew1179]

Yeah, someone in the camp could have killed Scott. Also, Scott could have been one of the sentries and just couldn't fend himself against Ethan.

[cocoMOE]

Its a purgatory-esque theory.

Very "Occurrence at Owl Creek Bridge"/Jakob's Ladder-esque, as well.

Could it be possible for Ethan to have twisted Scott's arm behind his back and crushed it while snapping his neck at the same time? Normally, I think this wouldn't be an easy attack, but Ethan has been made out to be this stealthy, super-fighting action figure. I don't know how much strength is needed to snap bones, but maybe twisting his arm behind his back was the trick. Plus, if he broke his neck at the same time, there would be no screaming and such.

[LoStMyMiNd]

As you may recall when they survivors found Scott on the beach Jack said the kliller came in from the water. I don't think Scott was killed by Ethan. But I do think that Scott's neck had to have been broken first and the rest of his bones second and/or post mortem

[cocoMOE]

and I just realised that I was trying to say exactly what you said yung. But you did much better. :)

[spooky]

No... my instinct tell me it was something or someone else.

I have the same gut reaction, JG. I have not a shred of evidence for it, and all the reasons why it's not so seem perfectly reasonable. Maybe it's just that Charlie creeped me out when he said with such certainty that Ethan deserved to die. Judgments like that might lead a boy to troubled times ahead.

[christine9]

I agree with a lot of that theory. But, the only thing holding me back from it is interaction. If these people are in the process of dying or already dead how are they interacting with each other? I think they feel remorse for events or deaths that each individual feels responsible for. I think Shannon is already dead. I think either Boone killed her or the boyfriend killed her and she is on the island so that Boone can deal with the death he is responsible for. These are just the random thoughts of a lunatic. ;)

[Chance Gardener]

Yeah, thinking it was the stobor.



...or....maybe....all of a sudden Vincent comes back!!!


Coincidence???????


hmmmmmm.........

[clone11]

I think Scott died from the same thing the swimmer died from.

There is something connected to the cable that goes into the ocean. Whatever it is, it sucks people down with tremendous force. Scott could have been standing near the surf and got dragged in.

[MonsterEatsPilot]

If Scott was dragged in how did he get back out onto the beach?

The swimmer who died was never recovered as far as I can recall.

I like to think Ethan made his way to the shore from the sea, pulled Scott under, broke his arms and his hands and neck and then let the surf carry him back to the sand. He was found on the beach, correct?

This would be an efficent and stealthy way to do it and when you are being held underwater, nobody could hear you scream.

-P

[sawyerhasbestlines]

Swimmer vs. Scott

It depends on where the tide is. If whatever is down there is large enough it can function as a reef. So if the tide is in, a wave could smash someone down onto it, thus breaking his neck in shallow waters. Fingers and flailing limbs could theoretically break also if the body was repetively smashed into the sunken (vessel?); till he eventually washes ashore dead.

On the other hand, in the case of the swimmer, she could have been sucked down over the outer edge, if the tide was out. Being a scuba diver, she could have been curiously been lured down after discovering the object.

My money is not in the bank with this idea. I just don't think Ethan killed Scott. Too boring. It's a red herring. It just seems like the cable topic got dropped and it's a way for the writers to introduce that idea back again, and Danielle.

- Sawyerhasbestlines ... I'm back - yeah! aka clone11

[MonsterEatsPilot]

I do not buy this yet.

I think Ethan killed Scott.

I do not know why I am hanging onto this so dearly. Sorry folks.

I think Ethan killed Scott to prove his point. Simple as that.

Have we been shown anything else that would disprove this belief?

Am I correct in assuming the cable going into the sea is nowhere near the beach. Didn't Sayid come across this after walking the beach for 2 days?

This would put it a good distance away from the survivors camp.

But you gotta wonder why Sayid and the rest of group have not yet mounted a exploration party to find Danielle again and the cable.

Or why Locke hasn't gone to speak to her yet--- seems like something he would do...

She seems to be the only person with any answers a this point in time.

Cheers!

-P

[Air91]

IMO, I know that we did not see anything that would point to Ethan not killing Scott, but it just seems odd that the writers would put in a coversation specifically addressing the mutliple injuries. Injuries that would be very unusal for someone killed in a hand to hand situation.

I would go along with Ethan wanting to make a statement, but I think him telling Charlie what he was going to do, allowing the survivors to prepare and set up guards and fires, and then still being able to kill one of them without detection is statement enough. Knowing that you are not safe even surrounded by guards in your own camp is quite a statement.

If Ethan did take the time to break all those bones after killing Scott.....he is one sick unit.

[lungcandy]

come on people! ethan is not a "normal" man. this is not just a crazy guy kidnapping and killing for his own personal reasons. there are much larger forces at work here. you've got to look at the bigger picture.

[LoStMyMiNd]

Ya know what? Maybe one of the guards klilled Scott, its possible. In which we have a killer amongst us.

[yung23]

I'm telling you, its possible to do that much damage with just self defence training..
My father is a seventh Dan black belt from Hagashi Karate studios in toronto. I read all his books, you can actually kill a guy just by pressure points.

Ethan killed him, just like he said he would, stop reading so much into every episode.

[Kimber and Bunny]

This person argued that the entire show takes place over about 20 seconds while the plane is crashing. When the monster kills someone, they are actually dying in the plane crash. That's why (according to this theorist) the monster is invisible and makes mechanical sounds. That's also why Rose says that the monster's sounds are "familiar". The vast majority of the show is the characters' subconscious attempts to resolve issues in their life before they die.

Sounds an awful lot like Jacob's Ladder. A pretty freaky flick that about half this message board is too young to remember.:o

Here's the synopsis from Netflix:
Vietnam veteran Jacob Singer (Tim Robbins) is tortured by psychological demons in this supernatural thriller. Singer has returned home to New York, but the death of his son and flashbacks from the war continue to haunt him. Although he receives help from his girlfriend (Elizabeth Pena), his ex-wife (Patricia Kalember) and an insightful chiropractor (Danny Aiello), the line between reality and delusion becomes increasingly blurred.

In the movie, it turns out that his Vietnam flashbacks are not flashbacks at all, but what is Really happening. Everything else, the people he knows in his 'present', his job in the 'present' etc are all in his head. But the war is not his only set of flashbacks: he is haunted by his relationships, particularly with his dead son, and how his actions affected those around him.

We keep getting flashbacks of the plane going down. We keep seeing flashbacks of different points in different characters' lives that they regret...and, like Jacob, they keep finding themselves in a very strange 'present' full of 'demons' (Others, and monsters and polar bears, oh my!) and illusions (Locke, Jack and Boone's Vision Quests).

[yung23]

jacobs ladder hmmmm...

[sawyerhasbestlines]

Hey Yung,

"I'm telling you, its possible to do that much damage with just self defence training.. My father is a seventh Dan black belt from Hagashi Karate studios in toronto. I read all his books, you can actually kill a guy just by pressure points."


My b/f has 3 blackbelts in Karate and other martial arts, and he endlessly analyzes the fight scenes. From watching the Jack/Ethan fights he doesnt' think Ethan fights like a martial artist. "There were many lost opportunities to knock Jack out with his elbow, and by applying pressure points.."

I know the show set us up to believe Ethan killed Scott, but I'm not sold yet. I still don't even know what's real.

[LoStMyMiNd]

I think the writers purposely did not show who killed Scott because they wanted us to think that Ethan killed him to prove his point......but I don't buy that yet either. It simply writer misdirection

[Lost at sea]

I think you're all looking way too deep into this. Ethan told Charlie that he was gonna killsomebody every day until he got Claire back, so he was lying? and someone just happened to die the day after he made the threat? Ethan killed Scott, plain and simple. As for the "tide" killing the people or whatever is supposed to be down there, how many times has Jin, Charlie, Hurley and Claire all been in the damn ocean? A bunch of times and none of them were sucked down. Ethan wanted to show the survivors what he was capable of to scare the crap out of them so they would give Claire back.

[LoStMyMiNd]

Looks like Lost At Sea is sold writers. Good Job!

[tavella]

Fingers are easy to break; the radius and ulna are fairly slim, so also believable. But the humerus? That's a serious bone. And the diary went on to say that *every* major bone in his body was broken. I'm trying to imagine someone managing to kneel on a body and bend a thigh in half with their bare hands, and I'm having trouble. It sounds more like something you'd expect from Lostzilla.

[Wynter Zera]

If Scott had time to clutch his throat that would explain the broken hands. Ethan simply squeezed the hand along with the throat.

However,

I see one VERY disturbing possibility. Someone (Ethan?) gained control of Scott's mind and caused him to strangle himself... Can Locke's visualization technique(focusing the ego and ID to work together) be used as mind control? Did Ethan not have to come close because he could visualize/focus on Scott killing himself and make it happen?