Orientation film (Web Maze / spoilers)

[see you in the next life]

HIGHLY SPOILERISH

HIGHLY SPOILERISH

HIGHLY SPOILERISH


WE NOW HAVE 57 OUT OF 70 SEGMENTS FROM THE VIDEO WE HAVE DISCOVERED IN THE LOST EXPERIENCE GAME.


IF YOU ARE INTERESTED, AND BELIEVE ME, IT IS EXTREMEMLY INTERESTING, SIMPLY CLICK THE LINK BELOW TO VIEW IT.



HansoExposed 8/25 53 Fragments (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWn7E4dKOyU)
04:35

[lacenaire]

So, spoilers in GD?

http://www.thefreeimagehosting.com/Uploads/Images/5395071925000spoilers.jpg (http://www.losttv-forum.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=13)

http://www.thefreeimagehosting.com/Uploads/Images/5395085987501webmaze.jpg (http://www.losttv-forum.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=62)

[LPU]

It's labeled as such, so I don't see the big deal. The mods will surely move it if it is.

[lacenaire]

Yeah, it has 0% content related to the show
and 100% related to the game.

So imo it's pretty easy to figure this one out.

[LPU]

Haven't we already had this discussion?

[Hurley4Prez]

Well, that video definitely gives a lot of information about DHARMA. I appreciate the efforts of all of you glyph-hunters out there.

But I'm also a partial believer of the "DHARMA distraction" (as LIW would say), so I don't know how relevant any further information is at this point.

[LPU]

Do people really believe that DHARMA is over and done with on the show? Or is it just that they think that it holds no true significance to the overall story?

[snakey]

I am really laughing out loud right now, ya know this is gonna be moved real fast so why bother. The game and the show are 2 different entities if someone wants to get involved in the game, come to the webmaze!

[GerfalconCP]

yeah. this isn't spoilerish in the sense of the show in the long haul, i think it's the producers' way of answering questions that we will never ACTUALLY see answered on the show. Sort of a cop-out in a way. But i likey ... when the whole things put together, make sure to post it here! I wanna see the end result ... (I like how they didn't forget the radio tower. that makes me happy. OH! That and the numbers mean something!!! The Valentzi equation ... im glad that they dont mean nothing, like the producers kept telling us. :) )

[NeillT006]

Do people really believe that DHARMA is over and done with on the show? Or is it just that they think that it holds no true significance to the overall story?

They just don't want distractions from the truly important discussions, as in the NMM thread.

N.

[clayseason1]

I am really laughing out loud right now, ya know this is gonna be moved real fast so why bother. The game and the show are 2 different entities if someone wants to get involved in the game, come to the webmaze!
Thank-you snakey.

I'm beginning to think there is a behind-the-scenes group of webmaze posters with a mission to spread this video to those of us that are not interested in the maze. This is about the fifth time I have come across some one posting a link to this video, exhorting all to view it.

[Warthawg1]

"They just don't want distractions from the truly important discussions, as in the NMM thread."


"Truly important" is defined by the people involved.

[NeillT006]

"Truly important" is defined by the people involved.

You would think so, wouldn't you?

N.

[Found in the Land of Lost]

I, personally, appreciate the video and the information it brings. Very enlightening and interesting. However, we all know where to go if we want to view this stuff, and I like it kept separate. Although this particular thing is obvious as to where it came from, there have been a few cases where webmaze info has been presented and not identified as such, and it's confusing. I know I'm sort of newish, but why is it such a big deal to keep it in the webmaze forum? I'm really curious, and I'm not trying to be sarcastic....

[Warthawg1]

You would think so, wouldn't you?

N.

Yes I would.

[NeillT006]

I'm really curious, and I'm not trying to be sarcastic....


Go practice and come back later.

N.

[NeillT006]

Yes I would.


Me too.

N.

[LPU]

How mad will everyone be if/when this info. suddenly does become relevant on the show?

[lacenaire]

[...] we all know where to go if we want to view this stuff, [...] this particular thing is obvious as to where it came from, [...] why is it such a big deal to keep it in the webmaze forum?

http://heraghty.diaryland.com/images/shrug.jpg

[Found in the Land of Lost]

Go practice and come back later.

N.

Lol, okay. But I really don't get why some people are so adamant about not keeping it separate. I've read through some of the discussion about it, and I still don't understand.

Oh well...

[NeillT006]

How mad will everyone be if/when this info. suddenly does become relevant on the show?

Well, they will never know.

Things will be revealed on the show in typical LOST fashion: ambiguously. There will be lots of discussion. There will be incorrect conclusions. But no one will ever be able to tell a poster why they are incorrect. The mere act of hinting that one ought to go look at the TLE video, or some other source, will be viewed as tantamount to a spoiler since the suggestion itself means that there is something revealed in TLE which is different from what the poster is saying. So, pretty much it could get pretty stupid.

N.

[Noav Sigless]

I tagged it as webmaze. That should help.

[Found in the Land of Lost]

I tagged it as webmaze. That should help.

That makes a difference, for me at least, when it's specified as webmaze (not just as a spoiler) and hidden in it's own thread or spoiler tag, that I can choose to view or not.

[karate schnitzel]

is this true to the Lost series story, or is it made up purely for webmaze?

[LPU]

is this true to the Lost series story, or is it made up purely for webmaze?

Now there's the question, ain't it?

[John]

This thread is off topic. Frankly, the original topic doesn't belong in this forum. I'm trying to decide if I should move it or lock it.

[LPU]

*sigh* So I take it there is no consensus even among the mods how to treat this type of material?

[lacenaire]

Is this true to the Lost series story, or is it made up purely for webmaze?
I think I may know that one.
There once was an island to where people were snuck,
doomed or blessed, they would never come back.

For the Hanso Foundation, one in each hatch,
6 orientation movies were made in a batch.

Alvar Hanso seen an old man in one,
on several fakes looked surprisingly young.

[Hurley4Prez]

How mad will everyone be if/when this info. suddenly does become relevant on the show?
Actually, how angry will everyone be when they view the DVD set?

[John]

Locking.

If another mod wants to do something with this thread, go right ahead. I'm not leaving it open, since it's off topic and has been discussed to death. I don't have time to watch it at the moment.

[John]

I'm going to re-open and move this thread to the Web Maze forum. I think that's the best place for it at this time. Please continue there.

[Without Dane]

Actually, how angry will everyone be when they view the DVD set?

Great point if you are referring to the supposed secret introduction to the Valenzetti Equation on the DVDs. If that's not a clue that the webmaze stuff is going to enter the show, then I don't know what is.

[NeillT006]

What I found silly about this whole episode is that there was actually no real discussion of the content of the video. What we had here was actually no more than a member "advertising" the existence and status of the orientation video to other members, encouraging them to go take a look if they wished to do so.

And I will listen to a reply that such a post had to be moved from General because it had nothing to do with "the show" when NMM is moved (which is not what I am advocating).

N.

[lacenaire]

I don't follow the NMM thread, Neill, but I guess it was at the beginning a General Discussion about what someone thought were “non-metallic metals”, the refutation of the «concept» by people who know a little science and at some point it must have gone off-topic and derived into some kind of Lostaways-GDiscussion.

This thread is not something like that. It is an intentional leakage of something that seeyouinthenextlife knew that it belonged in the ARG section of the boards or at best in the Spoiler Section.

To me the show has to reveal that it is telling the same story,
that the experience is to Lost like ‘The Silmarilion‘ to ‘The Lord of the Rings’,
if you like the analogy. If they are just parallel stories,
if the the experience is a spinoff or a sequel
then IMO it needs to be in a separate section of the forum.
If it is the same story, but anticipates things that haven't been aired yet
then it also needs IMO to stay away from GD and TS, that are «spoiler-free» zones.


I thought there was an agreement to wait and keep both things separate until there is confirmation that the show and the experience are connected by more than just vaguely alluding to similar themes and referring to the same organizations.

[see you in the next life]

"This thread is not something like that. It is an intentional leakage of something that seeyouinthenextlife knew that it belonged in the ARG section of the boards or at best in the Spoiler Section."



So, lacenaire, I'll dismiss all of the thank you e-mails I got from GD members for giving them a quick link to the video....that is, not a force-fed link, but one they had the free-will to choose to open or not.


For someone who rants against the corporate control of ABC with respect to this little Lost Experience game, you sure seem to support the "turf mentality" of the General Discussion area.

And by the way, and maybe NeillT would recall better than me, but I thought that the rule remained that anything goes so long as it is appropriately tagged.

You, yourself, would not consider the video link to be a spoiler, since we don't know if it is germaine (in your opinion) to the actual show. So, at worst, I posted a link to ARG material.

NeillT, didn't we (by that, I mean the board in general) decide that was still okay in GD as long as appropriately tagged?

[lacenaire]

Rhetorical questions:
- Do you dismiss the other people who may not agree with you?
- Why is there a Webgame&TS section?
- Do you intend to post all the Spoilers in General Discussion?
- What is the Spoilers section for?


Fact: Information from the webgame was posted in 2 non-webgame sections,
in GD you spoiler-tagged the title and in T&S you posted it without spoiler tags
in a non-spoiler theory. I am not gonna get in a semantic war for the use of the word «leakage»,
if you say so, I can agree that was an «important notice» full of «relevant information».
I still think it was not posted in the right place.

Opinion: I think it's my right to say what I think in a polite way.

Fact: I just pointed out there are 2 sections in the forum to post that kind of information.


This is something that has been argued over and over and we are not the ones
making the decision, a further debate is senseless.

Instead, please explain to me why...

For the Hanso Foundation, one in each hatch,
6 orientation movies were made in a batch.

Alvar Hanso, apparently an old man in one,
on several «takes» looked surprisingly young.

[see you in the next life]

In the Orientation film that appeared on the actual TV show, the, and I'll quote you here, "Alvar Hanso who appeared to be an old man" was represented by a simple still-shot taken from ground level across the street and directed through a window in a building. I would submit that it is unlikely that when the film was made someone said, "hey, I've got a great idea. For the shot of our benefactor Alvar hanso, someone run downstairs and go across the street and take the picture from as far away as possible, making sure that you make it grainy too." I would respectfully submit that the "still-shot" was more than likely a "stock photo THAT MIGHT NOT EVEN HAVE BEEN ALVAR HANSO. HE IS MISSING AND WE DON'T KNOW WHEN HE WENT MISSING (BETWEEN 1975 AND 1980 OR PERHAPS LATER). NOTE: Remember, the BLAST DOOR MAP indicates that there were a few more or less catastrophic events on the island, any of which could have involved A H."

The Alvar Hanso depicted in our video speaks and moves and who knows, might even be willing to do a little "Dharma dance" if we asked. This ORIGINAL DHARMA ORIENTATION video is also dated from 1975, several years prior to the Orientation film necessitated by the incident.

So, I guess THERE IS YOUR ANSWER. Surely you won't argue that the reason for including a still-shot taken from so far away is because the Hanso Foundation doesn't want anyone to see A H up close. If so, I would state that an even better idea would be to include a photo that ISN'T ALVAR HANSO AT ALL.


By the way, it would be nice to know who your quote was attributed to????

[lacenaire]

In the show no one has ever said Hanso was missing
so I haven't looked for him.

This unofficial ,
never aired
allegedly «original »
orientation movie
has been included in any official dvd,
has any sort of credits
or has it been confirmed
as having been done by the creative team
in connection to the TV show ?

I just don't want to spend time watching
material of dubious origin
or that does not pertain to the story
being told in the tv show,
however interesting and artistic and awesome it may be.

Neither do I want to see and know spoiler information
in case all those requirements were met.

What I am saying is that when ABC/Disney
releases the official list of websites,
crew and cast that participated in the game
I will gladly go and check it out.
In the meanwhile I'd rather not be called a fool
for not watching material that may not be official
nor related to the tv show.

[see you in the next life]

So, I assume if the Season 2 DVD actually contains stuff from the Lost Experience game you will flavor your words with ketchup and mustard and start eating them.


By the way, all you have to do is go to the official ABC Lost website and click on the link that says "Speaker" and pretty much all of this stuff from the Lost Experience game is right there. In fact, the official website Speaker forum is directing us to help us find the video fragments.

But we've had this conversation before.


I think I once asked aloud if you might be deliberately obtuse where this is concerned.....and I say that only because in ALL OTHER AREAS OF DISCOURSE ON THIS BOARD YOU HAVE PROVEN TO BE AN EXTREMELY ARTICULATE AND INTELLIGENT INDIVIDUAL.

[lacenaire]

I will not eat it because I only eat healthy food.

I said that once everything is published officially
and with the people involved (cast and crew) properly credited
then I will check it out. If the Lost experience alludes to things
on a dvd or the show it does not prove anything to me, sorry,
this is just what I think. It's in the show that Rachel, the podcaster,
the lawyer or the blogger will have to appear to reveal things to me.
I just want to know what is a game and what isn't
and you know that I don't think that the internet is a toy
for big corporations to spread lies and transform into a control tool
even if it just as inocent a thing as some fun game.

«Welcome to a site related to the official Lost Experience
developed by the creative team of the show Lost.
Click on the softdrink ad to know more about Hanso.»

I don't think that is asking too much.

[LPU]

It's been said plenty of times by TPTB that the WM is canon. Why do you have such a hard time accepting that lace? I mean who the heck do you honestly think is behind this?

[lacenaire]

«Welcome to a site related to the official Lost Experience
developed by the creative team of the show Lost.
Click on the softdrink ad to know more about Hanso.»

I wouldn't need to find out if this appeared clearly in all those sites.
Identifying them as NOT REAL and PART OF A GAME.
I need a disclaimer and the credits —I want to know what actor plays the podcaster,
what's the name of the actress that plays Rachel and so on.
Just because they are not real, only characters in a game.
THat is not happenning as far as I know.
Some video in youtube is hardly evidence of anything
and it doesn't have any «seal of approval» like the show,
which as far as I know TPTB have never failed to «sign»
with the usual credits at the beginning or at the end.

Why are they not «signing» the experience?

When they do I'will watch and read
whatever they officially declared as being created by them.
Only then.

I am not just going to watch any crappy video in youtube
and have people tell me what an ass I am for not watching it.

Over and out.

[LPU]

Ok then.

[see you in the next life]

You wouldn't have to watch it on you tube if you'd just go to the O F F I C I A L S I T E........you know, the one run by A B C.

Did IQ's suddenly drop dramatically in here?

[LostViking]

I will make a prediction that we will see this new video shown to Jack and Kate some time in the first six episodes. Fenry is going to tell Jack how the Others are the good guys, Jack won't believe him - so he will play the video.

Just my stupid guess :)

[Without Dane]

:yeah: It's gonna come up. I agree.

[snakey]

Dweisspt, I agree and like that you have my Fenry as the one showing it.

[snakey]

Great point if you are referring to the supposed secret introduction to the Valenzetti Equation on the DVDs. If that's not a clue that the webmaze stuff is going to enter the show, then I don't know what is.
sorry to double post but- since Bad Twin is part of the webmaze and it's what Sawyer was reading on the island and the author Gary troupe is supposed to have been on flight 815 when it crashed, it's no stretch to say they are/will be intertwined. Also the background of the Blackrock is a wee part of the ARG too. That's just a couple of vectors and if I wasnt so sleepy my lil brain would have more.

[LostEmissary]

I'll tackle this one for ya...

«Welcome to a site related to the official Lost Experience
developed by the creative team of the show Lost.
Click on the softdrink ad to know more about Hanso.»

I wouldn't need to find out if this appeared clearly in all those sites.
Identifying them as NOT REAL and PART OF A GAME.
I need a disclaimer and the credits —I want to know what actor plays the podcaster,
what's the name of the actress that plays Rachel and so on.
Just because they are not real, only characters in a game.
THat is not happenning as far as I know.
Some video in youtube is hardly evidence of anything
and it doesn't have any «seal of approval» like the show,
which as far as I know TPTB have never failed to «sign»
with the usual credits at the beginning or at the end.

Why are they not «signing» the experience?Becuase that's not how ARGs are done. It's simply a defacto "rule" of an ARG: the credits come at the end once the whole game is complete. At that time, you find out who all the PMs (Puppet Masters, aka creators) are, the actors, the writers, the artists, etc. That's simply one of the many unwritten rules of the ARG world - the fourth wall should not be broken until the game has finished. It's different from a television show in that way. Once it's done, you'll find all the confirmation you need, but to act like this thing is not "official" until the credits are displayed is like not admitting the existence of water until its chemical formula was discovered.

And just so you know, Javier Grillo Marxuach is DJ Dan - there's no doubt. If you've ever listened to any of his videocasts at AskJavi, then listened to DJ Dan, it's more than clear.



When they do I'will watch and read
whatever they officially declared as being created by them.
Only then.

I am not just going to watch any crappy video in youtube
and have people tell me what an ass I am for not watching it.That's a fairly closed minded view. I don't understand the harm it can do. And the video was placed on Youtube by players of the game... the actual video content is from a website (Hansoexposed) that is confirmed to be connected with this official game, that has not only been announced via official ABC press release before the game even started, but was also advertised during the show LOST itself (the Hanso Foundation commercials) which were narrated by Carlton Cuse himself (confirmed). Damon Lindelof and Cuse have both coyly discussed the Hanso Foundation website and the game itself as "official", but as part of that whole "unwritten rule" I discussed above, they won't come right out and talk about the inner workings of the whole thing at this time.

I'm not quite sure what you're looking for. It seems like you're just against the whole thing for the sake of having something to "fight against."

It's official, it's created by, among others, Javi himself who I promise you is one of the writers/actors in the ARG.

The other thing that seems to get overlooked a lot is that, supposedly, in this ARG, LOST is just a TV show as well, so the events that take place on the show are not considered "real" in the game. This has opened up all sorts of complications, but the basic bottom line of all this is that you will see that the ARG will be considered canon in the LOST universe, but not be considered canon in the LOST television show sub-universe of LOST mythology.

If you don't want to participate, that's fine. If you aren't interested in the video, that's fine as well. I, for one, don't care if someone doesn't want to have anything to do with the game or it's contents (although I do feel that said person is missing out on a ton of great stuff). What bothers me is this stubborn unwillingless to look at presented evidence that conclusively shows that the creative people behind the show are the people that have put together this ARG.

Like I said, when this is all said and done, we may not be able to consider the ARG canon in terms of the show, but it is as "official" as online content can get in terms of being endorsed, sponsored, and initiated by (at the very least) Damon Lindelof, Carlton Cuse, and Javi, if not more of the creative team behind the show.

If I'm misinterpreting what your claims are, my sincere apologies, but from the sounds of things, it seems you have some misconceptions about what this whole thing is.

[see you in the next life]

I just wanted those of you who have posted in this thread to know I truly, truly appreciate the support.


For the life of me, I just don't get it.

[DarthKitty]

I don't want to attack anyone, but the argument that "it's not official until they personally announce it" seems like it is just for the sake of arguing. That's JMHO.

[LPU]

For lacenaire -For the Hanso Foundation, one in each hatch,
6 orientation movies were made in a batch.

Alvar Hanso, apparently an old man in one,
on several «takes» looked surprisingly young.

Then explain the in show curiosity
of two different actresses
playing Des' Penelope.

[snakey]

Lac, they arent big on continuity on the show , it's the same in the game. This vid does show something no one has brought up. Doc represents science without the humanism and what that brings forth, using humans as test subjects for the greater good, in the process though he loses his humanity. I dont mean this in a religious way at all, the only thing I believe in is Nature, but the same argument would apply. Einstein wrote about religion and science and calls it cosmic religious feeling which fits here, it's what I think Alvar is talking about when he refers to Dharma the one true way. Mittlewerk THINKS he believes this but with a tad more Mengele than is healthy for humankind in it's cold use of human life to prove/fulfill his ends. So this puts Mittlewerk in conflict with Hanso and that's where the game stands now, we will have to see how it plays out in both the ARG as well as the show.

[bigmouth]

I will make a prediction that we will see this new video shown to Jack and Kate some time in the first six episodes. Fenry is going to tell Jack how the Others are the good guys, Jack won't believe him - so he will play the video.

Just my stupid guess :)
dweiss: Are you kidding me? That is an AWESOME guess!

[lacenaire]

For the record.
I do believe that the parts with the actor from Alias protraying Hanso
are legitimate creations.

I also believe it is not really that important
as it may seem.

I knew from the show that Dharma wanted to save the world.
I knew from the show there was something called «the Valenzetti Equation».
I knew from the show the Dharma Initiative was a reaction against the Cold-War climate of impending Nuclear Doom.
I knew from the show they were researching all those fields of science.
I knew from the show the island's location was secret
I knew from the show there were periodic food drops
I knew from the show there was a radio tower somewhere


What I didn't know is that the UN is behind the Dharma Inititiative somehow.



In sum, for me looking at this Low quality material
and the risks of watching fakes and/or red herrings
are not compensated by such small pay-off.

The new information in it is at any rate a Spoiler
and should be regarded as such imo and posted
in the specific sections dedicated to confirmed information
from the webmaze, that advances possible future developments of the plot.

[bigmouth]

What I didn't know is that the UN is behind the Dharma Inititiative somehow.
Lace: Oooh, careful! The UN commissioned the Valenzetti but the world's superpowers suppressed the results. It's not totally clear, but I personally don't think they're behind Dharma...
In sum, for me looking at this Low quality material
and the risks of watching fakes and/or red herrings
are not compensated by such small pay-off.
Have to respectfully disagree. There's much to dislike about TLE, which is why I don't play so much as free ride on the efforts of others. But I give TPTB credit in this regard: they've finally found an "official" outlet besides the show to distribute clues. Previously, there was MUCH more room for hoaxes -- indeed, the writers seemed to encourage them. Now hoaxes are ferreted out within hours and dismissed accordingly.

Besides, the principal purpose of the film seems to be to explain the Numbers, which is a hige clue. That's why I love dweiss's speculation that Jack, Kate, and Sawyer will be shown the film.

PS: I'm torn on the issue of labeling these clues spoilers. I don't dispute you're technically correct. But I also feel like we've lost some of our best posters in T&S because they now feel "tainted" by their Lost Experience knowledge. Over on the fuselage, they allow a bit freer reign to discuss TLE stuff on the theories board, which makes for more vigorous discussion. It's all a trade off I suppose...

[lacenaire]

Lol, BM I said behind «somehow».

This whole webgame issue is very moot as to how it relates to the show.
«Alternate reality» is a good label because I think the gameverse
is a parallel reality to the Lostverse.

The gameverse treats the Lostverse as a fictional tv show.
The people in the Lostverse do not know who Alvar Hanso is,
such a famous and relevant world figure in the Gameverse.


I am very sceptic, but not completely closed-minded to the information coming out of this. Not for anything I got 2 threads dedicated to scepticism applied to Lost.
I would be glad to learn that some scepticism is applied to the webmaze.


As a comment to the general public,
I have also stated many times already,
that to me, what it is objectable is not that they have tried to create
a multimedia experience
(I have said that this idea was good)
but the way that this multimedia experience
has been designed and carried out
using the worst tactics of corporate capitalism
and subverting and discrediting
the real use of the internet
(power to the people)
for the sake of entertainment.

Denouncing corporations and their criminal activities
is not something to be trivialized
in a game.
It is a very serious and important matter.
At least to me it is.

Filling intentionally the internet
with more pseudoreal websites
bogus information
and advertisements
is not something to be rewarded and praised.
Sorry, that's just what I think.

Taking into account all of that
and its being a blunt low-cost,
profit oriented
marketing campaign
with no credits given to the actors and people involved in the production,
make it a very very unpleasant «experience».

My motto as an epicurean
is to avert any pain or unpleasantness
that is not necessary
or that will not provide a bigger pleasure in the end.
It's a sort of «Moral economics» as J.S. Mill called it.

[NeillT006]

My motto is Let's Rock.

It would suck if this was the dawning of a new age but we slept through the alarm.

N.

[lacenaire]

Hi N.

Any dawning that comes out of this
is one that I will consider
a nightmare.

I'd rather think of this as a lame marketing ploy
than the beginning of something bigger.

Why don't they do this same thing
with the CIA and NASA secret archives?
Nothing relating to the present National Security of the US.

Let's say, the archives about secret Ops
in South America in the 60's and 70's.
The dealings with Saddam in the 80's
or with Bin Laden in the 90's.

I am talking about Disney/ABC,
the mediatic arm of the military industrial complex.

[see you in the next life]

NeillT...............tell me sir, why are you always the voice of reason?


You rock!

[drabauer]

I would urge everyone here to take a look at this blogpost television goes multiplatform (http://www.henryjenkins.org/2006/09/television_goes_multiplatform.html) by media maven Henry Jenkins. I've been talking to some folks who study interactive entertainment, and they see the ARG as a direct response to US; although there are problems with this summer's game, it's not going away.

Tonight was the first of 10 webisodes of Battlestar Gallactica that will lead up to the season premiere. Lost will be doing the same thing between seasons.

I really don't see how anyone can continue to draw the line at the broadcast tv show, but that's because I think it will be a dinosaur in a few years anyway.

[Echo]

with no credits given to the actors and people involved in the production,
make it a very very unpleasant «experience».



Lace, while I respect your reasons for not wanting to wade through the corporate ads and nods throughout the maze, (in fact i find it extremely commendable), you keep bringing up this point about "no credits given", when LostEmi pointed out earlier that to do so would bring down the 4th wall of the ARG. No ARG could still successfully suspend belief of an "alternate reality" while also giving out information about the actors in the game.

Also, with the way that it's set up, you could view the material (deemed canon by DLC) via links (such as SYITNL's) without viewing any corporate ads and bypassing any participation of said corporations. Of course, it is in your interest not to do so, and I respect that. Just pointing that out, because it seems most of your dismissal towards the webmaze stems from those points, 1) Corporate involvement 2) lack of credit and 3) questionable canon.

I understand and respect your stance on #1. I realize my suggestion to just view the information in its final form and avoid the hunt(and thereby corporate affiliation) could still be a cop-out, but I feel #'s 2 & 3 have been sufficiently refuted in this thread. Don't you?

[melostmo]

the dike is leaking... the dike is leaking
and all the people are running around...
what to do ? ... what to do ?

[lacenaire]

No ARG could still successfully suspend belief of an "alternate reality" while also giving out information about the actors in the game.
What is the tv show or a movie or a book anything other than an alternate reality?
You disconnect from your life and your brain for a while experiences the fiction vividly.
The process is not hindered by knowing it is a fiction
the process is a voluntary act
BUT
if you remove the «fictional» part
expressed by having credits, the name of the author in the cover and so on
then
you cannot distinguish fiction from reality,
you remove free will from the equation,
and it is no longer an alternate reality
it is a simulated reality,
a hyperreality.
A cooked up story for the general public to believe as real. http://www.loosechange911.com/
Welcome to the matrix.




Toc, toc.


DHARMA/ABC Has you - Corporate Control and Absolute Power (http://www.losttv-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=19592)

Since interactive technologies such as the Internet are based on multidirectional rather than unidirectional command and control, we expect to see an exponential increase in the potential for exploitation and control

[melostmo]

that's it ! ...good :)

they're all running around in here
save the people
don't let them drown

[lacenaire]

Melostmo, they can stay and drown if they want.
But from where I am I can see the water coming.
I won't stop for lunch as if nothing happened.

This is all about telling me everything is fine,
the dam isn't broke, come enjoy a swim in the pond.

[aggiesean]

Um...is it just me, or has nothing been posted on the actual topic of this thread, the orientation film, in a while now? Of course, we already (http://www.losttv-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=21995) have threads (http://www.losttv-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=19024) where this film is being discussed, with separate theory threads here that are too numerous to link. As well as a thread in GD (http://www.losttv-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=22909) focusing on the relation between TLE and the show. So unless this thread is being renamed to the "let's bring the argument back again" thread, I don't see why this is still going on. Not everyone is going to agree...can't we just accept this and let those who want to discuss the ARG discuss it here, those who don't want to not, and just move on?

:Cowdance:

[lacenaire]

I am talking about that movie seeyou posted about.
Not about the things you would like to talk about, maybe,
but about the absence of credits in it and what I think it means.
It's been checked and the actor appeared on Alias
so his bit as Hanso I think is completely legit as far as the game goes.
It is not an amateurish fake, even though it might have seemed so.
Now, how that relates to the show is quite another thing, imo.


I think you are free to post whatever you like about the movie
as much as I am, am I not?

[see you in the next life]

Well, quite obviously, this video is no more amateurish than the Dr. candle narrated Orientation film on the actual show. So, I don't see your point there.

As for how it relates to the show, we'll have to wait and see.

I didn't move this thread here. Someone with more authority than me did that....and frankly, I don't care.


The fact remains I didn't start the thread in G D to force Lacenaire to open it and take a look. I posted it there, appropriately tagged, for anyone who might want to take a look.

I received a few P.M.s from folks who generally don't visit the webmaze section and who felt a little lost when they did.....asking me how to access the video. I did what I thought at the time would be easiest for me.....I posted the link in G D.

Little did I know (in retrospect, I should have known) that it would not be easiest for me to do that, but rather, that it would start the same old sh*tSt*^m that we have seen all too many times. This time I didn't hear from Homer (and for that, I am thankful).

The thread was moved and then "the others"---who have a general disdain for the webmaze section---followed it here. Imagine that.

I was trying to be a nice guy (thanks to those who p.m.'d to thank me) and I WAS NOT TRYING TO UNDERMINE WESTERN CIVILIZATION, LAW & ORDER, OR ALL THAT IS COMMON AND DECENT.

[lacenaire]

Hi Seeyou

I never said you did.
I just explained why I am not doing this webmaze game.
You and LockePU explicitly asked about why I don't consider the webmaze relevant.
You have a different opinion, obviously, and you play. I have nothing to say about that.
I just complained when it was suggested I should-must play to understand Lost.
With that I disagree completely.

But I still read the results you, truffula, Pandora and others bring forth,
but I come here, to its allocated section, to read them.

Again, in comparison with the show, and only for technical reasons
like the style, the characters and its general low quality
(ideological bias aside)
the webmaze is a very unpleasant «experience»,
nothing near to watching a good episode of the show on dvd.

[see you in the next life]

Lace...........fair enough.

I happen to think the video quality is great. To me, it captures the same sort of "surreal" quality as the Dr. Candle video (which remains my singular favorite moment from both seasons).

However, I will agree that I DO NOT LIKE THE RACHEL BLAKE CARICATURE WITHIN THE GAME. It was always hard for me to wrap my brain around a seeminly teen-aged girl attempting to bring down the Hanso Foundation.


Now, more importantly:


For me, the show is the Dharma Initiative and The Hanso Foundation And the science-fiction component of the mythology. This is the primary reason that I steadfastly hang on to the notion that the game in inexorably connected to the show.

If, for example, it is revealed that Dhamra/Hanso is no more than some defunct experiment that took place on the island between 1975 and 1981, and that other than finding the hatch, it is really not relevant to the story of Jack, kate, Sawyer, etc.-----I WILL BE FURIOUS. I am not interested in Lord of the Flies and while I find the backstories entertaining, I presume we are being given those for a reason.

The biggest single reason I think that Dharma and Hanso still play a major role is that in the game we are seeing an active Hanso Foundation in 2006 (still working on and dealing with the numbers)---so, 2 years AFTER what we are seeing on the weekly TV show---Hanso is still an operating corporation.

I just don't see how it could be that they are no longer involved in the affiars on Craphole Island----or that they weren't involved in 2004.

The biggest disconnect in the game is not what happened between the incident and 2004, but rather what happened from 2004 until 2006 when Mittelwerk and Hanso are introducing this virus that is somehow tied to the (numbers/Valenzetti Equation).

I will reiterate that I consider it a loss for us on this board that certain among you, like you, Pinnerman, NeillT, and others, are not commenting on possible connections and assessing the information JUST IN CASE IT DOES SOMEHOW CONNECT.

NOTE: Let me be clear, I didn't say YOUR loss, I said ours. All of your intellects are greatly appreciated (at least as far as SYITNL is concerned).

[melostmo]

lace- of course I agree
I just don't see how the webmaze can be considered part of LOST
I came on board to discuss LOST- the series

btw- TPTB have promised us more action/adventure in S3. I'm very glad of that... it's the way LOST, S1, started,, so I hope we get more.

[NeillT006]

the webmaze is a very unpleasant «experience»,
nothing near to watching a good episode of the show on dvd.


And I am sure that listening to Eddie Cantor on 78s was not as good as the real thing.

But it was a start.

N.

[see you in the next life]

The world is changing.

There are still some folks who don't own a computer, never had one before, never needed one, still don't......but that didn't stop them becoming a vital part of the daily lives of billions the world over.

[drabauer]

I think the film will relate directly to the show, in that the remaining dharmites are still trying to change the variables through their work. There is no reason why the film-within-the-film won't likely be shown to our captives by Fenry, without the latter's knowledge that Mittelwerk is back on the mainland still working on his end. The film has provided numerous answers to rather inexplicable events:

1. the food drops;
2. the 'meaning' of the numbers;
3. the relationship of Hanso to the Degroots;
4. the probable existence of the virus (as a ruse to camouflage the introduction of an actual virus as a 'cure');
5. the centrality of our island to Hanso's project;
6. the all-encompassing nature of the Valenzetti equation (referencing pandemics, wars, natural catastrophes, etc.);
7. many 'brilliant minds' have been recruited;
8. the knowledge of the island and its operations are restricted to a small circle;
9. the moment and event that defined the birth of the Dharma Initiative,
10. what the Valenzetti Equation tells us;
11. how the results of the VE can be affected;
12. dharma the acronym;
13. the fact that the stations we've found are definitely part of a network;
14. the fact that the dharma initiative failed, and the numerical values remain the same;
15. the goal is nothing less than that of saving the world

[Richardstone]

Try explaining how it's not related directly to the show...

Now that's a post I'd like to read...

:)

[truffula]

I don't think I could've said it better myself, Dr.A :D

I will have yal know that when/if Fenry shows Alvar's Orientation film to Jack or whoever, I am gonna WIG OUT SO FREAKIN HARD!!!!! :hyper:

[Richardstone]

I don't think I could've said it better myself, Dr.A :D

I will have yal know that when/if Fenry shows Alvar's Orientation film to Jack or whoever, I am gonna WIG OUT SO FREAKIN HARD!!!!! :hyper:

Heh, that sounds like what I did when the blastdoor map came on screen, even though it was too small to see (I had to prove it with screencaps) I was well positioned (on my knees in front of the TV) to point and scream...

VALENZETTI!!!

...at my friend...

It was the final bit of proof he needed that TLE and the show are one entity...

LOST

:)

[lacenaire]

Hi drabauer

There's like hundreds of books based on The Lord of the Rings
BUT
that elements of the Lords of the Rings appear in those books
does not tell us anything about The Lord of the Rings.

The ARG is based on Lost mythology, I don't need proof for that,
but Lost does not have to be necessarily based on the ARG.


The film has provided numerous answers to rather inexplicable events: -->> Maybe not so inexplicable

1. the food drops; --> The show told us there were Dharma scientists on the island and there was a Lockedown procedure on the show.

2. the 'meaning' of the numbers; -->> Lindelof doesn't even know what they mean.

3. the relationship of Hanso to the Degroots; -->> Candle told us in the Orientation movie.

4. the probable existence of the virus (as a ruse to camouflage the introduction of an actual virus as a 'cure'); -->> Rousseau told us about the sickness. Ethan about the vaccine. Then Inman acted like if it was a hoax. The others don't use any special equipment to roam around the island. The others don't quarantine the losties when they have contact with them.

5. the centrality of our island to Hanso's project; -->> The show is about what happens on the island.

6. the all-encompassing nature of the Valenzetti equation (referencing pandemics, wars, natural catastrophes, etc.); -->> This would be a spoiler if it is actually developed in the show

7. many 'brilliant minds' have been recruited; -->> Swan Orientation Movie

8. the knowledge of the island and its operations are restricted to a small circle; --> Fenry told us the island was invisible even to God. He was being metaphoric, because at least "some of them" know about it. He was referring to the "outside world" I guess.

9. the moment and event that defined the birth of the Dharma Initiative, -->> Really not relevant, it's more important what they are doing not why, at least how I understand the story. I don't care much about ends. The ends can change in a community within days and things would still be happenning regardless of the change of goals.

10. what the Valenzetti Equation tells us; -->> This would be a spoiler if it is actually developed in the show

11. how the results of the VE can be affected; -->> -->> This would be a spoiler if it is actually developed in the show.

12. dharma the acronym; -->> This would be a spoiler if it is actually developed in the show

13. the fact that the stations we've found are definitely part of a network; -->> We know there are at least 3 stations on the island. The Blastdoor map showed us more stations and the Dharmatel network, etc

14. the fact that the dharma initiative failed, and the numerical values remain the same; -->> The show has the Dharma scientists posing as beggars, afraid of crossing lines, etc... THat doesn't spell success really.

15. the goal is nothing less than that of saving the world -->> Dr Candle in the Swan Orientation and Desmond told us in the show.



So, according to the ARG the show's core is "the Valenzetti equation"?
The reason for "everything happens for a reason" is the Valenzetti equation?

[NeillT006]

I counsel caution.

If and when the ARG video shows up in the broadcast (which I am pretty sure will happen) I will be suspicious that it is not the beginning of the end for the resolution of the island's mysteries and that, instead, there will be at least one or two more unexpected twists to be negotiated before we truly arrive at an understanding of the underlying character of the mystery.

We are only 2/5 through the story arc if we are to believe what we read. Laying out the basic framework of the mystery right now would seem premature in my opinion.

N.

[sculpey]

Thinks about venting, then becomes somewhat rational again.

[sculpey]

This is a great quote from Henry Jenkins:

" the use of the web not to remediate existing content from the series but to develop an extension of the fictional world which enhances our experience of watching the series."

To me the key word is 'enhances'. I love the show, therefore I want my experience of it to be enhanced. For those that don't want enhancement, see you Wednesday night's at 9 PM.

[lacenaire]

The problem with this Valenzetti equation thing for me
is that it sounds so dangerously close to David Koresh
claiming the End is near with Jesus coming back in a flying saucer and all.

I don't see any possibility other than a sarcastic and satirical show.
Some sucker pawned the money, there are no results, someone fleed with the money,
it's all a con, but hey, no one can check the island because there's a sickness, a hoax to gain time
and find who stole the money, make him pay. Ok, let's keep the embarrassment a secret, maroon the scientists and drop food every once in a while. Maybe even Hanso conned Paik and other industrialists out of a few millions.

I would even be tempted to say that Oceanic 815 was supposed to drop
food on the island but something happened with the cargo door and the plane
got ripped in 3 parts. Then the magic sand, the unique electromagnetic field
and Tinkerbell's stardust saved everyone from being spread over the island like butter on a toast.

[drabauer]

lacenaire, your answer to my list perfectly validated my point. That is, my impetus in making the list was NOT to say that one needed to follow the webmaze to get the show, merely that the two were connected. By pointing out the connections yourself, you have solidifed my argument. I expect the film to receive its broadcast premiere within the context of the show in season 3.

Your views on the mercenary nature of the ARG are well known. But how will you treat the 'webisodes' that are planned for the winter hiatus? These will not be designed as puzzles, but as short shows, a technique used by several quality shows, NBC's the Office and scifi' Battlestar Galactica among them (call it marketing if you will, but I draw no distinction between the marketing of the show and any other aspect of it).

By the way, if ABC persists on showing that abomination 'The Path to 911', I may be boycotting the entire network this year anyway :(

[melostmo]

^ I really disagree. The web or even LOST- TV are a take-off of LOST series, NOT part of it.
Why is it that JJ et al cannot seem to simply tell the LOST story in LOST series ?
If you can give me an answer to the above,, I'll listen... I'm all ears

You are (and I'm not singling out any one member) are allowing way too much leeway to authors, to bull<snip> you !
and when I feel I'm being bull<snip>, I don't like it...
neither do other members and viewers

It's as if you're saying 'go to the webmaze to find the explanations of the story'
what a bunch of crap...really !!

[LostEmissary]

^ I really disagree. The web or even LOST- TV are a take-off of LOST series, NOT part of it.
Why is it that JJ et al cannot seem to simply tell the LOST story in LOST series ? If you can give me an answer to the above,, I'll listen... I'm all ears
Because a lot of the story that we're getting in the ARG simply wouldn't work on television. The ARG is an interactive way to get more information out to the audience for those that want to know more. It's likely that a lot of the information revealed in the ARG may eventually be revealed on the show, but in a much different and less time consuming manner than what's been used for the web. It's just a different part of the story being told through a different medium.




You are (and I'm not singling out any one member) are allowing way too much leeway to authors, to bull<snip> you and when I feel I'm being bull<snip>ed, I don't like it...
neither do other members and viewers

It's as if you're saying 'go to the webmaze to find the explanations of the story'
what a bunch of crap...really !! I don't even know what this means. Any information that is critical to the story development of the show LOST will be revealed on the show itself. Any "important" information revealed in the ARG will simply be reinforced and reiterated during the show. Believe me. And if the information isn't re-revealed during the show LOST, then it was never critical to the story line in the first place, so why would it matter?

If someone doesn't want to participate in the ARG, don't participate. I just don't get the hostility. They're branching off onto the internet to give people a little bit of entertainment over the summer... how exactly that should make someone less happy with the show LOST itself is beyond me.

There is a far, far, far, far larger percentage of LOST viewers that do NOT have a clue what's going on in the ARG when compared to the amount of people that DO follow what's happening. And trust me, they know this. The "secrets" revealed during the ARG are either 1) completely inconsequential to the show, or 2) will also be revealed during season 3 and/or beyond, meaning the ARG amounts to nothing more than a "bonus/spoiler" for those that choose to follow along.

I mean, once again, you don't want to follow, that's perfectly understandable, but to say that what they're doing is "crap" "bull****" or some other is just absolutely confusing to me. They're not going to disregard the core audience, which is millions of people that aren't following the web experience. It's not like the show will leave millions of people in the dark about some critical fact that was revealed during the ARG.

Sometimes people just need to relax a little - it's just a TV show, and they're not going to alienate and confuse 99% of their audience just because 1% (or less) already know what Alvar Hanso looked like in 1975.

[Tater]

:yeah: good point Emi

yay for Lost and BOOOOO for the haters lol

[melostmo]

ok LostEmi, sounds like an honest answer

I reckon' the part that makes me a bit pissed is where some make a pretense that what you like to do IS part of LOST - the series- and introduce it often into General discussion

[LostEmissary]

ok LostEmi, sounds like an honest answer

I reckon' the part that makes me a bit pissed is where some make a pretense that what you like to do IS part of LOST - the series- and introduce it often into General discussion I understand what you mean - and to be fair, the ARG has tried to make it clear that in the world of this online game, LOST is just a TV show - the same as it is to us viewers. This makes things very confusing, but I think the point that the creators of the game are trying to make is that the ARG is a supplement - a new story based in the LOST "universe", not something that should be considered an integral part of the television show.

I think people on both sides of the fence sometimes overlook this point.

Yes, I do believe that there will be elements that cross over from the ARG onto the show, but those elements will be made clear on the show itself. Once again, they've tried to reinforce the idea that the game is not taking place in the same time and place as the TV show, and that to all the characters in this game - Thomas Mittelwerk, Rachel Blake, etc - LOST is also a TV show to them.

The best way I can put it is that the game is like a spinoff of the show, similar to how the show Frasier is a spinoff of the show Cheers. If you were a Cheers fan who watched Frasier, you'd pick up on nifty little cross-overs, like when a cast member from Cheers would show up on Frasier and you'd learn about what they were up to after the bar closed, etc.

I don't see it as any different than the novels that are written about Star Trek or Star Wars. You may learn some new and interesting things, but above all the movies themselves (and in the case of LOST, the show itself) is what stands as the most "important" thing, and all this ARG/webgame is doing is giving us a new little side story that's a spinoff of the show itself, and may reveal some nifty little secrets along the way. But rest assured if those secrets are important to the show, you'll find out about them in due time by watching the show itself.

[lacenaire]

Lostemissary that's a good way of putting it.
BUT
mind you
the spin-off books don't have to be true to the original story
because they go into things that were not part of the original story,
they only have to be «coherent» with it
or at least they should not «prove» false things shown in the movie.
Unless they are like the comic book «ultimate universe» thing,
a parallel story line where heroes meet on different occasions
and everything can be different.
Imagine a world with no X-men, that sort of thing.

I think that this ARG is something like that at best,
and the writers are comic book «experts».
Lindelof himself is an «ultimate universe» writer.

As for things like you said coming from the ARG into the show
I don't agree.
Imo they have sprinkled the ARG
with the mythology
and with tiny spoilers
of what will happen in the show
because they had already planned it
for the show.
And there are no red herrings in the ARG?
This year is the Valenzetti equation
(as the Blastdoor map proves an element long ago considered for the show, not the ARG),
last year was Apollo.
Remember the disappointment
when people found out there was
no Apollo theme
in the hatches.


THe flow runs in the opposite direction, imo.
LOST -->>>>> ARG.


Of course elements of Lost appear on the ARG, I mean, one would expect so, right?

The question is,
has any of the information about Lost
that has appeared on the ARG
been written for the ARG
or for Lost
and then rehashed and reformatted
to sprinkle it over the ARG?

[LostEmissary]

Lostemissary that's a good way of putting it.
BUT
mind you
the spin-off books don't have to be true to the original story
because they go into things that were not part of the original story,
they only have to be «coherent» with it
or at least they should not «prove» false things shown in the movie.
Unless they are like the comic book «ultimate universe» thing,
a parallel story line where heroes meet on different occasions
and everything can be different.
Imagine a world with no X-men, that sort of thing.

I think that this ARG is something like that at best,
and the writers are comic book «experts».
Lindelof himself is an «ultimate universe» writer.

As for things like you said coming from the ARG into the show
I don't agree.
Imo they have sprinkled the ARG
with the mythology
and with tiny spoilers
of what will happen in the show
because they had already planned it
for the show.
And there are no red herrings in the ARG?
This year is the Valenzetti equation
(as the Blastdoor map proves an element long ago considered for the show, not the ARG),
last year was Apollo.
Remember the disappointment
when people found out there was
no Apollo theme
in the hatches.


THe flow runs in the opposite direction, imo.
LOST -->>>>> ARG.


Of course elements of Lost appear on the ARG, I mean, one would expect so, right?

The question is,
has any of the information about Lost
that has appeared on the ARG
been written for the ARG
or for Lost
and then rehashed and reformatted
to sprinkle it over the ARG?I know exactly what you're saying, but I think many people read way too much into those little elements of the show such as Valenzetti equation and the Apollo bars. Those are minute details, even easter eggs that may only pay off for fans who are following the ARG.

I would bet that the extremely vast majority of casual LOST viewers never even remebered the word "Apollo" from the Apollo bar, and never expected anything to come from it. The same goes for "Valenzetti equation" which was only discernable after much detailed screen cap analysis.

I argue that these elements are far from integral story points. They are merely easter eggs that have paid off for those who follow the ARG. Now, they may also pay off in season 3.

By and large, the ARG has maintained what I believe in the end will amount to nothing more than a combination of a payoff of easter eggs from the show (Apollo Bars) and the occasional advanced spoiler for some of the bigger stuff (the purpose of the DHARMA Initiative).

Watching the show LOST is somewhat of a prerequesite to understanding the ARG - if you don't watch LOST, the ARG will be even more confusing and have less "payoff value" when it come to the easter eggs and the like. However, the converse is not true - it's not (nor will it be) prerequesite to have participated in the ARG to follow along with the show.

The casual fan of the show never saw the detailed blast door map like most of us did. They never translated the Latin, they never saw the word "Valenzetti" nor the words "known final resting place of Magnus Hanso." For those of us that analysed the blast door map in detail, we were treated to an extra layer of mythology and detail that the casual fan either didn't care about, or didn't know how to study in depth.

For me, the ARG is somewhat akin to that - it's an extra layer of mythology that is not critical to appreciating the show, nor will it be necessary in any way to follow the ARG in order to comprehend the events that are taking place on the island in the show.

The ARG does, however, similar to what the blast door map did, provide an expansion upon the mythology of the LOST universe.

This is also a key: you noted that those other spinoffs don't need to be true to the original, but like I mentioned, TPTB have gone on record more than once to emphasise that the ARG is NOT set in the same universe as the TV show. It's almost vice versa - according to the ARG, the television show is a simply a "story" that's being told within the ARG universe. With that in mind, nothing that happens in the ARG can be considered canon in the television show because we're supposed to pretend that the ARG is real, while the show is a somewhat fact combined with fiction television show.

It makes things a lot more confusing, but at the core, that's what an ARG is supposed to be - an alternate reality. In the ARG reality of the Lost Experience, the Hanso Foundation, the DHARMA Initiative, etc are all real things, and the show LOST is simply a television show based on those things.

For that reason, the Lost Experience is quite akin in "importance" to things like spin-off television shows and novels. It takes place under the same general set of rules, characters, etc, but is not canon when it comes to the "Main attraction" of the LOST universe, which is the show itself.

This is just my personal interpretation, anyway.

[Richardstone]

The Valenzetti Equation has been a part of the plot for LOST since the beginning...


(Q) Hello Gregg!

Now that the Lost Experience is winding down (looks like Javi, er DJ Dan's wrapping things up with his live podcast?) I had a few questions about what has been revealed:

*Did the NUMBERS need to be broadcast so the Hanso Foundation knew the exact moment one of the values changed?

*Do each of the NUMBERS as core values in the Equation also relate to the six experiments of the DHARMA Initiative. For example the end result of the Meteorology experiment was "8", Zoology was "42" etc.?

*And more a question about process: I'm fascinated that the Valenzetti Equation is an elegant mix of the Drake Equation and apocalyptic lore. Were the NUMBERS always meant to be that? How did you guys arrive at this concept? What inspired it?

Thanks, Gregg, as always!

CR

(A) From what I know, they knew initially that the numbers were related to the Drake equation in concept. I think it was Damon and Javi who came up with it, but I don't know for sure. I'm not sure what inspired it, but it was there from the beginning. Kinda cool, isn't it?

As far as your other questions, well that's more information that may or may not come out later.


http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?t=57422

[LostEmissary]

It's looking more and more like the ARG orientation film will be part of the show in season 3.

In the world of the ARG, considering that the music is the same on both the show and on the new ARG video, I think it's safe to assume that the creators of the show LOST somehow got ahold of a lot of detailed documents and videos about the DHARMA Initiative. (This is something else that has helped complicate the understanding of where the ARG lies within the LOST television show canon).

[LostViking]

If and when the ARG video shows up in the broadcast (which I am pretty sure will happen) I will be suspicious that it is not the beginning of the end for the resolution of the island's mysteries and that, instead, there will be at least one or two more unexpected twists to be negotiated before we truly arrive at an understanding of the underlying character of the mystery.

We are only 2/5 through the story arc if we are to believe what we read. Laying out the basic framework of the mystery right now would seem premature in my opinion.

N.

I think Neil is dead-on correct. I think this video will open more questions than answers.

I think there is a group that is working against dharma and its mission. Why do they want childern? Why do they want precogs? Psychics? Mind reading smoke monsters?

2/5 of the way through we get this video - I am happy to think they have given us this much texture so far - this means we have been given 40% of the story - 60% more of this type of stuff..Huray!!! I am loving it. I am completely satisfied with the video. It gives us a means and a motive for the others - and it is deep, conspiratorial and a fresh take on the evil government idea.



Not that anyone will care - but it was me who first specualted that Fenry will show the video to Jack - and when he does I am going to do the dance of being right for once :)

[drabauer]

Lace - neither you nor anyone else has answered my question about the upcoming webisodes - why are we still arguing about the ARG anyway? It's effectively over, although the information gleaned must still be repressed on this board ;)

[LostViking]

webisodes -

Can you tell me what this is?


By the way, the video also did not mention giant 4 toed statues - so I think there is a lot more to this story.

[NeillT006]

I think we need a term to describe those who frequent the internet for the avowed purpose of enhancing enjoyment of an entertainment, but whose vision becomes frozen upon the broadcast element of that entertainment to the exclusion of the web's broader vistas:

Webcicles

N.
Denominator of The Lost Experience

[lacenaire]

Lost emissary mentioned it before.
It will be interesting to know «the numbers» related to the ARG.
A reliable statiscal source is required, I won't accept Disney/Abc's statements
or corporate press releases as valid. Website hits are also SO NOT reliable.

About the «webisodes».
Will they come with credits?
Will TPTB take the responsibility and say:
«This is Lost (and not «this is about the possible backstory of the mythology»). Without watching this webisodes the tv-show will be a conundrum to you. Watch them or forget about the show. Goodbye.»
?

Will the webisodes have anything to do with the show? Flight 815, the island...
Will they be incompatible with the tv-show?

[NeillT006]

Go watch the Battlestar Galactica webisodes, Lac. I imagine it would be like that.

Which would be a good thing.

N.

[Richardstone]

Will the webisodes have anything to do with the show? Flight 815, the island...
Will they be incompatible with the tv-show?


I've read that Hurley finds a camera and starts filming the survivors of 815, so I guess it will have the same cast, each one will only be very short and I've no idea when (in the show) it will take place...

[NeillT006]

Well, that would be cool Richard. Maybe we will get to see more of Mr. Frogurt. He's my favorite.

N.

[drabauer]

They will first be offered to Verizon subscribers as downloads, then appear on the ABC website. They are likely to be humorous diary entries (by Hurley) that don't involve the plot of the broadcast show.

The Office Webisodes (http://www.nbc.com/The_Office/)

Battlestar Galactica (http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/)

[lacenaire]

Ok.

Just checked what a webisode is.
It's like a regular show, only shorter and released on the web instead of on the conventional cable-air medium, right?
If that's the case then my answer is pretty simple. Lost is the show not the medium it is being released. Cool it! The ARG didn't morph into something else when it jumped out of the internet into your tvs.

That aside, if they actually do it, they will force the non-us residents to keep using proxies to be able to watch the feed. Why do they do it? Don't they realize it is quite simple to bypass that kind of thing?

[NeillT006]

Lost is the show not the medium it is being released.

Welcome to the dark side.

N.

[lacenaire]

«Welcome home», you mean?
I haven't moved an inch.

I don't mind if they air the episodes or give them away with chewing gum
in holographic stickers. The show is the show. The marketing campaign
is the marketing campaign. One more platitude and the universe explodes.

BOOM!

(Oops)

[SageTemple]

Is this
the new
format for posting?

We
pretend that it's
a poem,
OR
are we really
just
channeling
William Shatner?

Now that I know,
the meaning
of the numbers
there is a massive
thread
to be mocked
in many
many
many
universes.

[lacenaire]

Away
Mock
Mock
Away

Away, away, away, away...
Mock.
Mock.
Away.

Mock, mock, mock, mock, mock, mock.
Mock.
Away, I say!

Mock.

[NeillT006]

Now that I know,
the meaning
of the numbers
there is a massive
thread
to be mocked
in many
many
many
universes.

I am always up for a good mocking. But be mindful that most divorces involve two people who were just right for one another. Certainty comes only with time.

N.

[drabauer]

Lace, you mean that you cannot access the flash video files in Europe? Is it really that the sites screen out foreign IPAs (I know that iTUnes has to do that for commercial reasons, but these are free), or is it that you lack bandwidth, or have turned off your javascript?

[Richardstone]

Anyone seen this? I just read it on Others Girl's blog, bold added to emphasise...

"Lost's Numbers Finally Add Up
ABC's online Lost supplement, the Lost Experience, delivered a major payoff on September 8th. An unlocked video detailed how a mathematician was commisionned by the United Nations in 1962 to calculate the timetable for humanity's extinction. The resulting Valenzetti's Equation was based on factors represented by Egyptian Hieroglyphics, each of which was assigned a numerical value: 4, 8, 15, 16, 23, and 42, aka what would become Hurley's cursed digits. Though the Hanso Foundation created the Dharma Inititiave to stave off the forecast apocalypse, the foundation's impatient acting president Dr. Thomas Mittlewerk is itching to unleash a virus that will snub 30 percent of the world's population.

Fans who followed the Experience may someday experience deja vu when watching LOST on TV. Says Michael Benson, senior vice president of marketing for ABC: "There's no reason [the Experience's events] can't be integrated into the program."


Deja Vu like....

"Hey I've seen this Orientation film"

:)

[ILoveEko]

Ooh, that's great!