View Full Version : Hey! Wait a second! How come...
Homer Noodleman
10-17-06, 05:02 PM
How come the Others didn't dress up like bumpkins when they went to steal the sailboat? They've made a big deal about playing dress-up when they were out and about all the other times, how come this time they don't bother with the fake beards and what-not this time?
Sloppy writing, or is there a possible reason for the lack of disguise?
ILikeLostBrunettes
10-17-06, 05:05 PM
*the sound of car tires screeching to a halt*
they see ALL
10-17-06, 05:08 PM
maybe because they intended to kill everyone on the boat???
zeke didn't hesitate to shoot at sun when he saw her...
good point though...
;)
Maybe they expected to capture Sun and/or the boat with no resistance while Sayid and Jin were playing treehouse... ??
Sun would have been the only one who saw them in plain clothes if it turned out that way.
Either that or they are done with disguises.... once Hurley gets back to the losties, the gig is up anyway.
bigsidd
10-17-06, 05:17 PM
Must have finally sent their disguises off to a dry cleaner.
Either that or they are considering opening up their operation to everyone on the island...Maybe because they expect Michael and Walt to arrive back in the lost camp soon who will tell the losties everything (with their spin on it of course)
Or they have already accomplished what the disguises set out to do in getting Sawyer, Kate and Jack as well as the rest of the camp into a false sense of security.
Another possibility is that they overlooked the chance of anyone being in the boat, expecting them all to be waiting in ambush for them on the beach while they snuck off with the boat.
They sent Hurley back to the camp after revealing they were in costume. Its probably not any more complicated than that.
Homer Noodleman
10-17-06, 05:32 PM
No, I don't buy Hurley being the reason. First, he -- like all of the castaways -- is basically an oblivious idiot. Why assume the fake beard would even register with these dunderheads? After all, they knew about it when they set off on their rescue mission. Secondly, Ethan and Goodwin pretty much tipped their hands long before the fake beard was found and that didn't stop them from donning the disguises. I 've kind of figured they did the bumpkin act to get the castaways suspicious of anybody else on the island they encounter -- for example the line of kids that walked past Eko and Jin.
So, outside of sloppy writing, why drop the act now? Doesn't that weaken the sense of confusion they have been so careful to sow?
The Central Scrutinizer
10-17-06, 05:43 PM
I, like Kali, think it was supposed to be a completely covert operation. One thing we've learned about these Others is that they are pretty damned full of themselves and treat our Losties like second-class citizens.
To extrapolate from that last that they believed they could steal the boat from under Sayid's nose seems logical.
Ben also asked Colleen/Trixie how quickly she could put together a team and she replied something like an hour. Time looked to be of the essence to them.
Maybe its because they already got what they wanted. They don't care anymore. Besides since they know Kate already knew about Tom's fake beard, they must suspect she may have told the rest of the losties.
interplanetjanet
10-17-06, 06:38 PM
They know Kate already knew about Tom's fake beard, they must suspect she may have told the rest of the losties.
That's my thought. They overestimate the losties communication skills; easy to do. Ben, who probably grasps their lack of sharing circle time, didn't issue more directives than "I want that boat." Pickett and Tom were there when Kate outed Tom; perhaps he was eager to volunteer they needn't bother with itchy fake beards and bare feet anymore.
the fake beard is the monster
Homer Noodleman
10-17-06, 06:54 PM
One thing we've learned about these Others is that they are pretty damned full of themselves and treat our Losties like second-class citizens.
CS,
Uhh... do you blame them? Jack decides to form an army, the rest of the castaways are too lazy to join it, and he ends up getting all his guns stolen anyways. Let's face it, our beloved castaways make the Keystone Kops look like a well oiled machine.
A dead Ethan and Goodwin didn't deter the Others from playing dress-up, why would a fake beard bother them?
My fear is it is going to be another vanishing chasm (and I still get pissed off just thinking about that scene), where they have a major point just disappear because the writers are too lazy to follow through. Dropping the costumes, because the audiance now knows they're fake, would be crappy writing in my opinion.
Well, Sayid found the fake camp too. They're smart enough to know that they aren't going to fool anyone at this point.
Subject # 4815162342
10-17-06, 07:30 PM
They sent Hurley back to the camp after revealing they were in costume. Its probably not any more complicated than that.
NO!.....Absolutely not!
Sayid,Jin,and Sun have been on that sailboat ever since Michael led Sawyer,Jack,Hurley,and Kate to the Others.......they have had NO contact with Hurley ever since then,therefore,they have no idea that the Others are not Hillbillies,as Michael said......
Heck,they don't even know that anyone's been kidnapped yet....well, except Waaaaaalt!
I think that it's as simple as either
A:They were in such a hurry to "assemble a team" to retrieve the sailboat,that they did'nt have time to get out the spirit gum,and makeup,and fake beards,etc........or
B:.....at this point,perhaps they feel it has just "gone too far" to uphold the charade any longer........Before,they were a subtle,passive influence on the Losties,now,they intend for this whole thing to be more direct,and Head-to-head.......
we'realllostinsomeway
10-17-06, 07:35 PM
I don't think there's really a point anymore, the people they were trying to fool are already in their control.
NO!.....Absolutely not!
Sayid,Jin,and Sun have been on that sailboat ever since Michael led Sawyer,Jack,Hurley,and Kate to the Others.......they have had NO contact with Hurley ever since then,therefore,they have no idea that the Others are not Hillbillies,as Michael said......
Heck,they don't even know that anyone's been kidnapped yet....well, except Waaaaaalt!
you like exclamation points a lot.
I'll simplify it even further..... fake beards are itchy and they dont wanna wear them anymore.
Subject # 4815162342
10-17-06, 07:51 PM
you like exclamation points a lot.
And elipses......
Unlocke Locke
10-17-06, 08:12 PM
I think its because the costumes were already discovered in the medicine hatch. I think the others have cameras in every hatch area on that island and they saw Kate (or whoever it was) dig out those costumes. They are probably thinking they won't be fooling anyone anymore and they may have had a more elaborate plan with the rafters. Last week was spur of the moment.
FireFly815
10-17-06, 09:13 PM
The Others have dressed in their costumes after the medical hatch being discovered.
Now maybe since Kate told Tom and Ms. Klugh that she knew the costumes were fake that they decided against the whole thing. My question is if that is the case, why dress up and try and trick them in the first place. What was the motive behind it if they are just not dressing up anymore?
I'm hoping the explanation for the no costumes is the lack of time the Others had to get dressed up and seize the boat.
ETA: I hope that this will get explained and not just be left as is like some of the other things that I would still like answers for!
The Central Scrutinizer
10-17-06, 09:16 PM
I, like Kali, think it was supposed to be a completely covert operation. One thing we've learned about these Others is that they are pretty damned full of themselves and treat our Losties like second-class citizens.
To extrapolate from that last that they believed they could steal the boat from under Sayid's nose seems logical.
Ben also asked Colleen/Trixie how quickly she could put together a team and she replied something like an hour. Time looked to be of the essence to them.
CS,
Uhh... do you blame them?
Jack decides to form an army, the rest of the castaways are too lazy to join it, and he ends up getting all his guns stolen anyways. Let's face it, our beloved castaways make the Keystone Kops look like a well oiled machine.
A dead Ethan and Goodwin didn't deter the Others from playing dress-up, why would a fake beard bother them?
My fear is it is going to be another vanishing chasm (and I still get pissed off just thinking about that scene), where they have a major point just disappear because the writers are too lazy to follow through. Dropping the costumes, because the audiance now knows they're fake, would be crappy writing in my opinion.
True, our heroes are a bumbling, tight-lipped lot. But does the simple fact that they're idiots make it okay to pick on them? Schoolyard bullies that brutally pick on the kids from the short bus should be reviled.
Not to say I think Jack and his merry band of clueless secret-keepers don't deserve a few atomic wedgies and tie-the-shoelaces-together pranks--they most assuredly do. But the child abduction, conspiracy and commission of murder, imprisonment and the massive mindgames that Henry and his uber-race have waged on our protagonists is way outta line.
the fake beard is the monster
Thanks. I just snarfed coffee on my keyboard.
LMAO
NeillT006
10-17-06, 09:20 PM
Its mid-November.
Halloween is over?
N.
Homer Noodleman
10-17-06, 09:29 PM
COLLEEN: We have a situation -- Ryan radioed in -- the Iraqi found the decoy village.
BEN: Good, it's what we wanted.
-------------------------
Well, I think that puts an end to the notion it was because of the fake beard.
While the Others were staging their little charade on the dock, they were anticipating the castaways would locate their fake village.
It is a deliberate change of tactics.
I think they freed Hurley so he would report back to the castaways that the Others kept their word and freed Michael and Walt. Could the Others be creating another little charade to create another false impression of their capabilities?
DreaminLost
10-17-06, 11:06 PM
I kind of thought the disguises were so they wouldn't be recognized--like someone might know them from their previous life--pre-crash.
Maybe they're not worried Sun, Jin, or Sawyer would recognize them.
It made better sense inside my head than in a post.
FireFly815
10-17-06, 11:14 PM
It makes sense to me. I would love to see some of the Others in the flashbacks. But if Ben was telling the truth and he has been on the island his whole life, does that mean the rest of them have been on the island their whole lives as well?
And if they didn't want some of the losties to recognize them, they obviously are not worried about Jack, Kate and Sawyer recognizing them either since they are now not wearing the costumes around them.
I really hope it gets explained as to why they are no longer wearing their disguises.
Andrew23
10-17-06, 11:17 PM
Maybe cause they were in a hurry?
Smirnoff_Ice
10-17-06, 11:22 PM
I think they freed Hurley so he would report back to the castaways that the Others kept their word and freed Michael and Walt. Could the Others be creating another little charade to create another false impression of their capabilities?
Possibly, but it could just be that there is no need now. They've got Ben back and could no longer keep Michael and Walt. They also have the three people they wanted most and Desmond's boat. They've sent Hurley back to the camp (which makes me wonder how he's going to make it across the island) to keep anyone else away. If they're planning on completely distancing them from any other survivors, why use a disguise?
How come the Others didn't dress up like bumpkins when they went to steal the sailboat? They've made a big deal about playing dress-up when they were out and about all the other times, how come this time they don't bother with the fake beards and what-not this time?
Sloppy writing, or is there a possible reason for the lack of disguise?
Well it was pitch dark plus this Ryan guy who radioed in that Sayid found the fake village, probably had a visual on them and saw that Jin and Sayid were on land and only Sun was on the ship who they either planned to kill or take to Sawyer and Kates work camp.
Note how they shot at Jin and Sayid when they approached the dock to try and save Jin, they knew exactly where those two were.
ureverybodyandsoami
10-17-06, 11:39 PM
The Others only put on their costumes when they are out of their green zone to mess with the minds of the Losties(or fit in after the crash) . The Others only go for the boat and only the boat. Also, Sun has never met Mr. Friendly before. She would never know if Tom was out of costume anyway.
Thanks. I just snarfed coffee on my keyboard.
LMAO
my pleasure, its just nice to know someone actually read the post and laughed. :D
Homer Noodleman
10-18-06, 03:37 AM
COLLEEN: We have a situation -- Ryan radioed in -- the Iraqi found the decoy village.
BEN: Good, it's what we wanted.
-------------------------
I've got the bit between my teeth now, no choice but to run with this one.
Again, the line of dialog above shows that the Others planned on having their act revealed. They could have dismantled the village, or at least removed the fake hatch door, had they wanted to keep stringing the castaways along. However, as Benry said, they wanted the castaways to discover the deception.
Why?
ANA: ...They're smart, and they're animals, and they could be anywhere at any time. Now we're moving through the jungle -- their jungle...
The Others have spent nearly two months establishing themselves as fearsome and unseen force living in the jungle. By infiltrating the castaway's camps, kidnapping people, and being several steps ahead of any of the castaways attempted responses, they've fed the castaways parnanoia and made themselves the boogey men of the island.
If I'm right in my other speculation, the three people they want most of all are Walt and Kate, who they already have, and Aaron who is still out of their grasp.
This change in tactics is as calculated as their earlier 'wild men of the jungle' schtick. I think what they want to do is pull the rug out from under the castaways, so the castaway's are more liable to consider the possibility that the Others are benign. The castaways might then drop their guard a little, and an opportunity to snatch Aaron might present itself.
What if one of the three captured is intended to be turned and released?
I think they really want Kate, and her mentioning Sawyer first means he's chosen for her to bond with and worry about so they can control her by threatening him. That means Jack would be their mark.
Benry rolled that TV set out and planted the notion that he was the avenue for Jack to get off the island. I think there will be a lot of effort into convincing him that he was wrong about the Others -- that they really are civilized and non-threatening. He'll then be sent back to the camp in hopes they can get him to move Aaron to a place where he can be taken.
They haven't stopped their charade, they've just moved on to a new version of it.
Margawt
10-18-06, 05:37 AM
The real reason the other's did not have disquises on is a simple one. It was because it was night time and they were conducting a raid to steal a boat. To wear a disquise you want someone to see that you are someone other then you intend to be. Since they did not want to be seen. All they had to do was wear dark clothing for the night raid and maybe face paint (but we know collen and zeke did not have face paint but were wearing dark clothing).
ISLANDLEA
10-18-06, 06:25 AM
How come the Others didn't dress up like bumpkins when they went to steal the sailboat? They've made a big deal about playing dress-up when they were out and about all the other times, how come this time they don't bother with the fake beards and what-not this time?
Sloppy writing, or is there a possible reason for the lack of disguise?
hi, I think we have the "CREATIVE LICENSE" thingy going on again,, so never call it or any other gross mistakes in script or narrative Sloppy writing it's refered to by JJ as "CREATIVE LICENSE" ... lea
Tanatie
10-18-06, 08:07 AM
could it be that it was a plan to capture sun and not even the boat? I mean I know what benry said, but he could have alternative motives. Sun is pregnant and she was on the boat...the only thing out of the plan was that she had a gun...
could it be that it was a plan to capture sun and not even the boat? I mean I know what benry said, but he could have alternative motives. Sun is pregnant and she was on the boat...the only thing out of the plan was that she had a gun...
Good theory....... but when they found out, they had no way of knowing whether Sun would be on the boat or not.
Hey Homer if you're reading this, bearing in mind Benry's "Good, it's what we wanted" comment about Sayid finding the fake village, do you think the hatch Claire, Kate and Rousseau found in Matenity Leave was deliberate also?
F F Woodycooks
10-22-06, 06:21 PM
Granted I've never been on any sort of midnight raid wearing a fake beard, but to me it seems like costumes, including fake beards and such, aren't condusive to midnight sailboat raids. I also suspect that they were planning on capturing or killing anyone who got in their way... It seemed as though Sun was about to be their prisoner, and the others did start firing on her as she made her escape... although I suppose that could have been simple retribution for her shooting one of them.
meljo93
10-22-06, 07:30 PM
No, I don't buy Hurley being the reason. First, he -- like all of the castaways -- is basically an oblivious idiot. Why assume the fake beard would even register with these dunderheads? After all, they knew about it when they set off on their rescue mission. Secondly, Ethan and Goodwin pretty much tipped their hands long before the fake beard was found and that didn't stop them from donning the disguises. I 've kind of figured they did the bumpkin act to get the castaways suspicious of anybody else on the island they encounter -- for example the line of kids that walked past Eko and Jin.
So, outside of sloppy writing, why drop the act now? Doesn't that weaken the sense of confusion they have been so careful to sow?
I like this line of thinking the most.
Maybe they dressed like that to make the castaways suspicious of people who dressed and looked that way. Dressing like that may also be safer when traveling around the dark territory, or where the security system is.
In other words... if there are two groups of Others, maybe Ben's group uses the disguises to travel in the perimeter of the others camp without triggering the security system. When the losties crashed, Ben's group used the disguises to keep the losties from trusting/joining their rival group.
Sorry for rambling... it made more sense in my head:Hippy:
Darkshines
10-22-06, 07:36 PM
Granted I've never been on any sort of midnight raid wearing a fake beard
You're really missing out, trust me on this.
bigsidd
10-22-06, 07:44 PM
You're really missing out, trust me on this.
Even while travelling on a boat? I would imagine a beard would have pretty good water absorption properties, it could get pretty heavy, pretty quickly:)
P.S. Didn't I see you hiding in MY front garden a couple of nights ago wearing a beard and hobo disguise? Or was it my drunken mum...again.:(
Darkshines
10-22-06, 07:53 PM
Even while travelling on a boat? I would imagine a beard would have pretty good water absorption properties, it could get pretty heavy, pretty quickly:)
P.S. Didn't I see you hiding in MY front garden a couple of nights ago wearing a beard and hobo disguise? Or was it my drunken mum...again.:(
No, it was my shift in the TV surveilance room, I think that may have been Juliet......
Frecklestoo
10-22-06, 08:53 PM
I kind of thought the disguises were so they wouldn't be recognized--like someone might know them from their previous life--pre-crash.
Maybe they're not worried Sun, Jin, or Sawyer would recognize them.
It made better sense inside my head than in a post.
It makes sense out of your head, too.:) If they know who's in the boat and they aren't afraid of being recognized, then they don't need disguises.
Homer Noodleman
05-23-08, 11:44 PM
OK, this is even more puzzling. Why was Alpert again dressed like a bumpkin when they captured Kate and Sayid?
That act can't possibly be for the castaway's benefit anymore, so why are the Others still donning disguises?
I never understood the reasons for the disgusies in the first place.
Ben was unhappy when Captian Friendly didn't wear his silly disguise although the Losties were bound gagged and obviously not getting off the Island.
In fact Ben never expected any of them to get away so WTF was he so upset about?
Even if one managed to get home, what are the odds he or she would ever run into an Other?
And who is trolling the waters that close to Craphole? Wouldn't they be leaping to their deaths or having their heads explode without a constant?
RangerMel
05-24-08, 12:29 AM
Maybe they're not costumes, per se. Maybe Alpert and Co. are like the Amish. Frivolity is bad. And so are flashlights.
shoop_puveler
05-24-08, 01:39 AM
I think they may be trying to pass themselves off as indigenous/original inhabitants to the freighter folk. They may just want to be viewed as "Non-Ben-People" to falsely acquire their sympathy/allegiance. Holding Kate and Sayid hostage only strengthens their position...to con.
Wouldn't they be leaping to their deaths or having their heads explode without a constant?
daniel said the problem for des was that he had recently been exposed to radiation, homer; that caused his time-wonkiness. and apparently, taking the wrong heading to the island (like minkowski) causes the same problem (makes the theory of the island being surrounded by a force field sound plausible here.)
we have no idea what kind of exposure the freighter folks have received, but the madness they've been having is prolly not the same thing. and remember, des freaked out, but sayid has been fine.
re the clothes-- maybe for richard, the suit and tie is the costume.
Homer Noodleman
05-24-08, 04:11 AM
The bumpkin duds bring Jacob pissing and moaning about a flashlight to mind.
I may be out to lunch, but I've always believed that the line of kids Eko and Jin hid from weren't the Others. Special kids are the focus of the story in some way. Could that line of kids be connected to the whispers, and could they be a barely seen force on the island that even Ben and the Others are worried about?
GardenMom
05-24-08, 05:09 AM
I thought the "bumpkin" clothes Richard is wearing were the same "camping" duds that he had on when Ben gave him orders to lead the Others to the temple.
This kind of makes Richard sound like a Ken doll. Barbie had her dream house and Richard has a plastic temple, complete with TWO changes of clothing...YOU choose! Will you make Richard be a bumpkin or dress him in his Rod Serling suit?
Spybinder
05-24-08, 05:05 PM
This may be a stretch but, maybe when Ben signaled with the mirror it was a message that they are getting ready to move the island. Perhaps Alpert and company are wearing the proper clothing for the time/place they are moving the island too?
Kentstater72
05-27-08, 03:25 PM
The bumpkin duds bring Jacob pissing and moaning about a flashlight to mind.
I may be out to lunch, but I've always believed that the line of kids Eko and Jin hid from weren't the Others. Special kids are the focus of the story in some way. Could that line of kids be connected to the whispers, and could they be a barely seen force on the island that even Ben and the Others are worried about?
I have always thought that the other others were outcasts of the others, strays from previous landings on the island, and/or those trapped between two worlds (the voices).
I think that with the storyline getting shorter it may be too late to introduce another group into the mix.
The other Others or whatevers comments are intiguing. But is there a way to name these people? Just going by indications in the very tangled plot line how many groups are there so far?
What do we call the people Patchy gave up some of his farm animals to since he was connected to Ben it seems to be yet another group?
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