S3 EPISODE 7 THREAD 07-FEB-07: Not in Portland

[Brian]

This is the discussion thread for the next LOST episode, "Not in Portland"

Please post all your episode comments, mini-reviews, as well as simple questions ("What did so-and-so say?" "What did so-and-so see?" "What song played at this scene?") regarding the episode.

Any new theories or big issues raised by the episode may be started in a new thread.

Enjoy the episode!

NOTE! - For those who didn't know already, LOST will be airing at 10PM EST for the remainder of the season. Please check your local listings so you don't miss the episode.

Unlocking. Please keep all countdowns, etc in the Hype thread. Thanks!

The episode ended at post #164.

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Episode Description:

LOST is back and all new for 16 straight weeks! In the return episode, Jack is in command as the fate of Ben's life literally rests in his hands.


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There are just a few things that I'd like to mention in order to hopefully make everyones viewing of the Episode Discussion Threads a little more enjoyable:

* First off, if you haven't already, please take a moment and view the Welcome Forum (http://www.losttv-forum.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=2) as it is quite easy to get lost here. Many questions can be answered by simply taking a few moments and reading the Welcome Forum.

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* Have a theory that has possibly been mentioned before but you have a different twist on it? Then take a look at What I think is going on (http://www.losttv-forum.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=5).

* Both "Guys? Where are we?" and "What I think is going on" are where you can re-hash old ideas, concepts, and theories to your hearts content without worrying about your posts being merged or moved.

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* If you have a question about what so-and-so may have said in a past episode, please take a moment and look through the transcripts (http://lost-tv.com/transcripts/index.html) of past episodes. Our very own spooky puts a great deal of time into creating these for us and she's rarely, if ever, wrong in her transcription.

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* If you're looking to see if something has been posted here before related to LOST, please take a moment and perform a Search (http://www.losttv-forum.com/forum/search.php) of the forums. That link will allow you to search the entire forum in the event that you may not know where something has been mentioned or is currently being discussed. Those of you who have been with us since before we moved to our current location probably know that the Search function at our old home didn't work very well, if at all. However, the Search function here is very thorough so please utilize it.

* If someone uses a word, acronym, or slang that you're unfamiliar with, please check the LOST-TV Dictionary (http://www.losttv-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10085) before asking what something like TPTB means.

* If you're having a problem unrelated to LOST and need help from the moderators and/or administrators, feel free to PM any of us. We'll be glad to help you out. You can find a list of the mods/admins here (http://www.losttv-forum.com/forum/showgroups.php) as well as at the bottom of the thread listings for each individual forum.


I simply added these links in order to keep non-episode related material out of the Episode Discussion threads. Material that is non-episode related clutters the Episode Discussion thread and makes it difficult to navigate for many.

Thank you all for your time.

[Dagolu]

alright! first post!

so I've already seen the episode on ctv but I won't give away any key points until you bring them up. I'll put forth my ideas as they appear. (chat room doesn't work for some odd reason)

[treygar]

juliet is beautiful, i'm assuming this is a juliet episode.

[Dagolu]

yeah they're in miami

[treygar]

you think sawyer killed him?

[Dagolu]

he gave him a pretty good jolt!

[Mysterious Mike]

Juliet's sister is the same women who played Calamity Jane on Deadwood.

[FoundandLost]

Great opening scene!

[Lostitute]

In the hallway...who did Juliet pass? Looked kinda (emphasis on kinda) like Ethan!

[Fletcher]

Another location fake out! What the hell is Ethan doing in Miami?

[Mysterious Mike]

It was Ethan

[Dagolu]

I'm having trouble getting into the chat room! I get a message box that it can't download the thing because it's an unknown file? any help?

[C_Lost]

In the hallway...who did Juliet pass? Looked kinda (emphasis on kinda) like Ethan!

I believe it was Eathan

[Selestina118]

It was Ethan.

:Cheers:

[Matthew.Lann]

So far, so good.

[Lostitute]

Opening had me going. Glad to see Sawyer give Pickett his due!

[Hurley4Prez]

Beautiful shot of Miami. Great cinematography, as always.

[C_Lost]

Jack said take Sawyer and go...He did not say that at the end of Season 2


edit: i mean the last of the first part of season 3

[Dagolu]

yep ethan... I won't tell you why he's in miami.. yet...

[Hawksrule]

Juliet in Miami? So much for the Others being permanent to the island. Though Benry could be different in that regard. Juliet flashbacks would be nice. DId they come to the island to cure her sister's cancer?

Action - NICE job Sawyer! I wonder if that guy's shock will keep him down for long.

I figured Juliet would have a hard side. But why stop Jack from doing what he wants? She must fear some discovery that Sawyer and Kate may make on their way off the island.

[ScoobMaster]

In the hallway...who did Juliet pass? Looked kinda (emphasis on kinda) like Ethan!

definitely ethan

[Brian]

I'm having trouble getting into the chat room! I get a message box that it can't download the thing because it's an unknown file? any help?

Dagolu, check this thread (http://www.losttv-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27398). It's helped most people with chat issues in the past.

[FoundandLost]

I think Juliet is pregnant. No evidence just a hunch.

[treygar]

jack finds out they are on another island. juliet was married, what was that guys named.

[Mr. Doug]

This series gets me fired up. I don't like that it's at 10:00pm now...

[SimonO]

jack finds out they are on another island. juliet was married, what was that guys named.
Edmund.

[Mr. Doug]

Damn...I wish Pickett would have died.

[kanamit]

I think Juliet is pregnant. No evidence just a hunch.

She looked it on the beach.

[treygar]

uh, I think Jack just made a major mistake turning on Juliet like that..

[Dagolu]

thanks

[treygar]

ok...where have we heard Edmund's name?

[C_Lost]

they caught up pretty fast

[Mr. Doug]

NICE!

they caught up pretty fast

They knew where they were going...

[treygar]

cool another Sawyer nickname, Sheena!!!

[Mr. Doug]

Ben looks bloated..

[Lostitute]

Alex to the rescue! Wonder if she's actually trying to help Sawyer and Kate, or if this is part of the Others' plan.

[An"Other"]

what the crap was that?

[Hawksrule]

So, did Juliet's videotape just disappear? Glad to see Alex involved, that could relate to my thoughts in post #20. I guess we'll definitely see if Jack is willing to kill Ben- since the walkie-talkie is shot.

But if it's hard to kill a patient, how much harder is it if the patient can speak?

[Mysterious Mike]

Still no Locke or anyone else.


Dammit

[Lostitute]

When Juliet's cell rang,as she was about to pinch some serum, she was called Dr. *unintelligible*. Anyone catch her last name?

[Mysterious Mike]

I think it was Burke

[Pippa]

I don't understand what Benry just said, what does it mean?

[Lostitute]

I think it was Burke

Thanks Mike!

[Pippa]

The new research assistant looks like a man.

[SimonO]

Yet another philospher: Edmund Burke

[treygar]

Hmmm....so Juliet joined Dharma perhaps to do her research and get away from Edmund?

[Mr. Doug]

Underdog...awesome!

[treygar]

Underdog...another great Sawyer nickname!!!!

[Mr. Doug]

Ben is evil...I love it.

[Pippa]

Lol one gentleman to another.

[Mr. Doug]

can anyone read lips?

[treygar]

i knew they weren't gonna let us hear what they are saying!!!!

[Dagolu]

three minutes... remember when mike only got 3 minutes with walt?

[Mr. Doug]

...upside down?

[Dagolu]

I'm sure we'll get someone to read lips before next episode

[Pippa]

Oh snap!

[Fletcher]

Juliet's a lot more tricksy on the island as opposed to her flashbacks. She was horrible about hiding her emotions around her ex but on the island lying seems to be her nature. And if the theories about Juliet and Ben are true, you have to wonder how many ex-husbands has she had?

By the way, anyone notice the Jack/Ms. Klugh parallel? "You have three minutes.

[SpacedinLost]

Yeah, love the upside-down angle there. Maybe he's doing something completely opposite of what we'd expect? Turning our expectations "upside down?"

[Dagolu]

really shows how creepy the others are...

[FoundandLost]

I want to know what Ben told Juliet!

[Lostraveler9]

Ben looks bloated..

Cause he's laying on his face!!!!!!!!! Duh!!!!!!!!!!!

[Lostitute]

"I'm Tom, by the way..."

Best line so far this epi!

[ScoobMaster]

this makes me think Juliet is gonna be exiled with the losties

[Mysterious Mike]

I like the Others more at this point in the episode.

[Dagolu]

... I'm not watching (already saw it on ctv)
what scene is it at?

....tom/jack oh

[Lostitute]

I think it was Burke

Ahh...Burke's actually the name of the guy Juliet worked for (with?), the laboratory lothario. Interesting proposition he offered her.

[Pippa]

Juliet said she's gonna go help Jack's friends escape.

[Selestina118]

... I'm not watching (already saw it on ctv)
what scene is it at?

Juilet just said that she was told by Ben to help save Kate and Sawyer.

:Cheers:

[SpacedinLost]

"I'm Tom, by the way..."

Best line so far this epi!

My thought exactly! That was pretty funny.

[Lostitute]

Yet another philospher: Edmund Burke

Good catch, Simon!

[Dagolu]

ok thanks

[blondiejam]

http://www.mittelosbioscience.org/


can anyone check if it's real?

[treygar]

Juliet is a doctor, even though she is a fertility doctor, she should know how to stitch up Ben right?

[Mr. Doug]

"I'm not a leader....I'm a mess."

[Lostitute]

Dang, how much eyebrow pencil and eyeliner does Mr. PowerPoint need?

[Dagolu]

cool

[Selestina118]

Is that guy wearing eye liner???

He kind of looks like Dr. Mittlewerk from Hanso Foundation, too.

[RoseArienh]

Nice camera shots!

Blondie, there's a thread in Spinoffs.

[Dagolu]

and she probably wouldn't be able to with the exact precision needed for spines

[treygar]

i always feel like, Juliet's watching me!!!!

[Dagolu]

it has to be real
ethan rom is on the page

ETA - checking out the site. it's probably real or has been made by one of the lucky ones who get to see episodes early



Mod Note - www.mittelosbioscience.org (http://www.mittelosbioscience.org) is a confirmed FANSITE.

[Mr. Doug]

"Wookie Prisoner Gag"

[SimonO]

http://www.mittelosbioscience.org/


can anyone check if it's real?
Looks like a fan site; poorly put together; the image quality is very very poor. The domain is also hosted away from any of the known abc stuff.

Definite fan site.

[treygar]

what kind of brainwash tactics are those

[beerman]

what's with the crazy room the guy is in...wow, those are some special glasses...

[Dagolu]

juliet's one of the staff on the site...

[Mr. Doug]

Whoh...This is messed up.

[Dagolu]

what you are seeing is called the Ludovico Technique (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludovico_Technique)

[Selestina118]

Oh, man, we definitely need screencaps from that sequence!

[Mysterious Mike]

THAT WAS FRAKKIN AWESOME

[treygar]

that room was so 'emo'!!!.....hahah. wish i could put all the emo kids in there and lock them away with their miseries.

[SimonO]

"Jacob" has to be "him". That image in the video said something along the lines of "God loves you, as he loves Jacob". Now: who in the blue blazes is Jacob?

[Lostitute]

Looks like a fan site; poorly put together; the image quality is very very poor. The domain is also hosted away from any of the known abc stuff.

Definite fan site.

Service unavailable is all i get.

[FoundandLost]

Woah! Carl is being brain washed!

[Lostitute]

Yeah...that room was so Clockwork Orange...times 10!

[Brian]

what you are seeing is called the Ludovico Technique (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludovico_Technique)

That explains the Clockwork Orange reference. Thanks Dagolu for the link!

[kanamit]

what you are seeing is called the Ludovico Technique (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludovico_Technique)

http://myspace-881.vo.llnwd.net/01353/18/86/1353236881_l.jpg

[Hawksrule]

Calling it now - Juliet's ex-husband meets an unexpected demise.
"the Wookie Prisoner gag!"
Reprogramming Karl -but didn't we hear them shoot him?
Seems like Kate might be willing to do whatever it takes to escape- including kill. Maybe she should keep the rifle - she's a much better shot.

What did Sawyer think while seeing those messages? Is he thinking that he needs to stop running from the good things in his life?

[Selestina118]

"Jacob" has to be "him". That image in the video said something along the lines of "God loves you, as he loves Jacob". Now: who in the blue blazes is Jacob?


I saw a fraction of that. The Hanso pic from the DHARMA videos was in it, too.

:Cheers:

[Fletcher]

Creepy brainwash room! :D "Redeem yourself" "God loves you" The Others really seem fixated on purifying people.

[Lostitute]

"Think about your life"

"Everything changes"

WTF?

[treygar]

'...someone to follow, we want you Big Brother.' - Bowie.

[SimonO]

Service unavailable is all i get.
Probably crashed due to all the hits. It looks to be hosted on a standard cheap hosting account on 1and1.com (yes, I was bored between first watching the episode and now)

[Mysterious Mike]

They left when it was getting to the good part. there was a Degroot on that thar screen

[Dagolu]

just went through the website. it includes parts of this episode before it aired. either a very privledged fan's site or another part of the mini experience

[SpacedinLost]

"Jacob" has to be "him". That image in the video said something along the lines of "God loves you, as he loves Jacob". Now: who in the blue blazes is Jacob?


I read it as, "God loves you as he LOVED Jacob." In the Bible, Jacob messed up a lot, but was still loved and forgiven by God. I interpreted it as them brainwashing him by making him believe that even though he "messed up" they'll still keep him 'in the family.'

[Dagolu]

yeah I saw gerald degroot too

[beerman]

this episode is crazy. whoa! sister's pregnant now...wait, maybe her sisters kid is the one helping sawyer and kate get away...perhaps.

[SimonO]

just went through the website. it includes parts of this episode before it aired. either a very privledged fan's site or another part of the mini experience
Oh, the backend of it is well put together (though the frontend isn't), but it's not an official site, do a search on google for more info and be prepared to be shaken up.. haha

[beerman]

holy ed just got messed up...

[Mr. Doug]

Look out for the....


....bus.

[kanamit]

oh crap

[RoseArienh]

ooof!

[SpacedinLost]

[quote=Hawksrule;1298708]Calling it now - Juliet's ex-husband meets an unexpected demise.
quote]


Yep, I'm with ya... Saw that bus coming, didn't we?

[SimonO]

Jack teasing Tom: Classic lost moment :D

[Diamondduste]

Tthis episode is crazy. whoa! sister's pregnant now...wait, maybe her sisters kid is the one helping sawyer and kate get away...perhaps.

That's Danielle's daughter Alex.

[treygar]

wow...I"m thinking Final Destination. that was whacked out and pretty violent if you ask me.

[nbrendal]

WHOAH!!! GO JULIET!!

[SpacedinLost]

Buh bye, Danny Boy!

[seymour.w]

In Carl's video, the last thing I saw while sawyer waws carying him out was one of the Dagroots on the screen. Kinda weird...

[Diamondduste]

In Carl's video, the last thing I saw while sawyer waws carying him out was one of the Dagroots on the screen. Kinda weird...

I'm glad I wasn't the only one who thought he saw Mr. DeGroot.

[Lostitute]

OMG! Jules just wasted Pickett!

[treygar]

holy crap Juliet is so complex...she can kill...she can save...she can create life.

so did her sister have cancer or something or am I way off?

[SonOfSawyer]

wow...I"m thinking Final Destination. that was whacked out and pretty violent if you ask me.

This is why lost is better at 10 pm

[Selestina118]

holy crap Juliet is so complex...she can kill...she can save...she can create life.

so did her sister have cancer or something or am I way off?

It appears that she had cancer.

:Cheers:

[Lostitute]

holy crap Juliet is so complex...she can kill...she can save...she can create life.

so did her sister have cancer or something or am I way off?

I'd say you're thinking the same thing I am. Ovarian cancer or uterine cancer maybe? Unable to conceive. And Juliet's research allowed her to become pregnant.

[Brian]

Danny died! That just made my episode!

Good riddance!

[Mysterious Mike]

This is why lost is better at 10 pm



Totally

[SimonO]

So, either Ben and Danielle did the dirty dance or Ben is the adopted (and not biological) father of Alex.

[Hawksrule]

heh- I called it- hard to tell if she was just shocked that he was hit by a bus, or shocked it happened after her request.

Danny is dead! who's nose is Sawyer gonna break now? You think Juliet did it as redemption for her ex's death?

Mittelos - haven't we heard of that company before?

[Dagolu]

I heard someting about a glyph on the bus... but noone can verify that now... crud

[beerman]

T

That's Danielle's daughter Alex.


ooooohh. :D

juliet kills danny? to help the 4 of them get away...ben still dies cuz jack messed up maybe? or jack pulls the surgery off and is kept prisoner there, until the rest of the group comes to the rescue?

[charliesalinger]

some kind of ovarian cancer if i were to guess

[Fletcher]

So Juliet perfect a treatment to get her sister pregnant-- Juliet killed Pickett. She's a pretty damn complex character. Obviously, life on the island has hardened her a lot. DHARMA's power just keeps growing-- now they can arrange things so that certain people are hit by buses?! And what's the deal with Alex? Is Ben her adoptive father, or was Danielle lying about Robert?

[SpacedinLost]

It appears that she had cancer.

:Cheers:

My guess is that she had cancer and had a hysterectomy. Juliet helped her get pregnant without a uterus somehow. Otherwise, how would this be an "event?" People get pregnant in doctor's offices every day (infertility treatments).

[Brian]

This is why lost is better at 10 pm

Totally

:yeah:

If things keep up like this, then the move will be well worth it.

[Dagolu]

hmmm... If danielle were an other, I'd lye

[SonOfSawyer]

I heard someting about a glyph on the bus... but noone can verify that now... crud

a glyph ?!! they are back ?

[Mr. Doug]

I don't like 10:00...I get too riled up this late.

Jack is the man...look how calm he is. He's my new hero.

[Dagolu]

possibly... I'm not sure but the website mittelosbioscience.org seems legit
it had info from this episode before it aired, so the experience may be starting up again

[SonOfSawyer]

poor alex :(
I don't understand why she stayed. what would Ben do if she is gone?

[treygar]

man Tom was just about to say something important before Jack hit that other artery...about how things changed when the sky went purple....anyone else catch that...

[Dagolu]

I'm sort of thinking that they're going to make jack do the clockwork orange's Ludovico Technique (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludovico_Technique) thyrapy now...

[SpacedinLost]

So the Boss is Alex's father. Does that mean it's Ben?? And so Ben and Rousseau were together??

[stephew]

I don't like 10:00...I get too riled up this late.

Jack is the man...look how calm he is. He's my new hero.

Mittelos is an anagram for time lost. and in entertainment weekly they said an anagram will be in tonights series that underlines the mythology. and this will point to the two skeletons. my theory? the two skeletons are two of our lost crew and time is lost on this island (more on this concept on entertainment weekly)

[treygar]

am I the only one who wants to see a Juliet/Kate makeout scene?

[Diamondduste]

poor alex :(
I don't understand why she stayed. what would Ben do if she is gone?

Probably would have gone after Karl.

[Dagolu]

probably... unless ben is more of an "adoptive" father

but they really just took her

[stephew]

and for those curious, the anagram analyzer shows its an anagram for:
MILE TOTS
MILE TOST
LIME TOTS
LIME TOST
MOTLIEST
SLIME TOT
SMILE TOT
LIMES TOT
MILES TOT
ISLET MOT
ISLET TOM
STILE MOT
STILE TOM
TILES MOT
TILES TOM
TITLES OM
TILE TOMS
TILE MOTS
TILE MOST
LITE TOMS
LITE MOTS
LITE MOST
TITLE OMS
TIMES LOT
ITEMS LOT
EMITS LOT
SMITE LOT
MITES LOT
MITE LOST
MITE SLOT
MITE LOTS
ITEM LOST
ITEM SLOT
ITEM LOTS
EMIT LOST
EMIT SLOT
EMIT LOTS
TIME LOST
TIME SLOT
TIME LOTS
SITE MOLT
TIES MOLT
TIE MOLTS
ELM I TOTS
ELM I TOST
ELM IS TOT
ELM TIS TO
ELM ITS TO
ELM SIT TO
ELM TI SOT
ELM IT SOT
ELM TIT SO
MOLE TITS
MOLES TIT
MOTELS TI
MOTELS IT
MOLEST TI
MOLEST IT
MOTTLES I
MOTEL TIS
MOTEL ITS
MOTEL SIT
MOTTLE IS
ELMS I TOT
ELMS TI TO
ELMS IT TO
SMELT I TO
MELTS I TO
MELT I SOT
MELT IS TO
MELT TI SO
MELT IT SO
OLE MITTS
LOSE MITT
SLOE MITT
SOLE MITT
OLES MITT
TOLE MIST
TOLE SMIT
LETS I MOT
LETS I TOM
LETS MI TO
LETS OMIT
LETS TI OM
LETS IT OM
LEST I MOT
LEST I TOM
LEST MI TO
LEST OMIT
LEST TI OM
LEST IT OM
LET I TOMS
LET I MOTS
LET I MOST
LET MI SOT
LET MOIST
LET OMITS
LET ISM TO
LET MIS TO
LET IS MOT
LET IS TOM
LET TIS OM
LET ITS OM
LET SIT OM
LET TI OMS
LET IT OMS
EM LIST TO
EM SLIT TO
EM SILT TO
EM LIT SOT
EM TILT SO
EM TIS LOT
EM ITS LOT
EM SIT LOT
EM TITS LO
EM TI LOST
EM TI SLOT
EM TI LOTS
EM IT LOST
EM IT SLOT
EM IT LOTS
EM TIT SOL
ME LIST TO
ME SLIT TO
ME SILT TO
ME LIT SOT
ME TILT SO
ME TIS LOT
ME ITS LOT
ME SIT LOT
ME TITS LO
ME TI LOST
ME TI SLOT
ME TI LOTS
ME IT LOST
ME IT SLOT
ME IT LOTS
ME TIT SOL
SOME TILT
MOTES LIT
SMOTE LIT
TOMES LIT
TOME LIST
TOME SLIT
TOME SILT
MOTE LIST
MOTE SLIT
MOTE SILT
EMS LIT TO
EMS TI LOT
EMS IT LOT
EMS TIT LO
STEM I LOT
STEM TOIL
STEM TI LO
STEM IT LO
MET I LOST
MET I SLOT
MET I LOTS
MET TOILS
MET LIT SO
MET IS LOT
MET TIS LO
MET ITS LO
MET SIT LO
MET TI SOL
MET IT SOL
TOES MILT
TOTES MIL
TOE MILTS
TOTE MILS
TOTE SLIM
SET I MOLT
SET MIL TO
SET LIT OM
SET MI LOT
STET LIMO
STET MOIL
STET MI LO
TEST LIMO
TEST MOIL
TEST MI LO

[beerman]

ethan's back

[Mr. Doug]

Ethan is creepy...

[Diamondduste]

So the Boss is Alex's father. Does that mean it's Ben?? And so Ben and Rousseau were together??

No, remember:

Alex was abducted as a child so technically... there is a possibility she isn't even aware that Danielle is her mother. Ben seems like the type that would make all the abducted children call him father.

[stephew]

Mittelos is an anagram for time lost. and in entertainment weekly they said an anagram will be in tonights series that underlines the mythology. and this will point to the two skeletons. my theory? the two skeletons are two of our lost crew and time is lost on this island (more on this concept on entertainment weekly)
http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20010504,00.html

[Lostitute]

Yeah. Ethan's creepy.

And, after the joke Jules made with Mr. PowerPoint, about a bus hittin' her ex (Ed), I think his actual death by bus was arranged by Dharma.

[treygar]

ok...when Ethan and Juliet passed each other in the first scene, where were they a hotel hallway?

[SonOfSawyer]

So the Boss is Alex's father. Does that mean it's Ben?? And so Ben and Rousseau were together??

not necessary, Ben might have been Alex's father figure since they kidnapped her as an infant, but I don't think he is her biological father.

[Dagolu]

that's what I meant thanks for rephrasing!

[Mr. Doug]

So she got roped into being there too...

[beerman]

the island is near portland?!

[Lostitute]

OMG... good epi!

*rewinds tape to watch again*

[treygar]

hmmm....not my fav episode but it truely makes you wonder how even the Others get trapped on the island?

[Nevrast]

If they really wanted to whisk Juliette away, don't you think it would be wise to kill Edmund in a different manner than one which would arouse Juliette's suspicions.

[truffula]

It will take some time for me to type up all my notes, but I would like to say how pleased I am that we got confirmation of OFF ISLAND "Others" Recruiters - might I also mention privately funded, my bet would be by none other than THE HANSO FOUNDATION. :D

Oh yeah baby, ALVAR HANSO is so toughly running EVERYTHING on that Island. He is the GRAND MASTERMIND behind it all. Mark my words. ;)

[SimonO]

If they really wanted to whisk Juliette away, don't you think it would be wise to kill Edmund in a different manner than one which would arouse Juliette's suspicions.
Possibly to show that, even though they deny it, they plant seeds of knowledge with her that they really can arrange anything.

[Dagolu]

hmm do you notice that juliette on island is slightly different from juliette off island? I'm thinking that all others recruits are subjected to the Ludovicio technique (the thing used on Karl) before they are members

it accounts for their creepyness

[Shesablondebomb]

I know exactly what you mean Truff!!


What a great epsiode.

Poor karl :(

[FoundandLost]

Tom was about to answer Jack regarding why they went through the trouble of bringing him to the other island instead of just getting outside help. Tom replied they were until the sky turned purple and was cut off before he could finish. However the sky turned purple the day the others took the losties. If what Tom was about to say is true that would mean the sky has turned purple before. If he what he was about to say is false then that means the real reason Jack, Kate, and Swayer being kidnapped has yet to surface.

[Gifted1]

This was a great episode. It had a little of everything. cant wait til next week.

[Diamondduste]

hmm do you notice that juliette on island is slightly different from juliette off island? I'm thinking that all others recruits are subjected to the Ludovicio technique (the thing used on Karl) before they are members

it accounts for their creepyness

Agreed - it would explain the whole "We're the good guys" line they always give.

[louise71594]

Very good episode, well worth the wait!!! I especially like the ending. The guy in the suit with Ethan is dangerous, even more creepy than Ben. He scare me!

[sawyersgirl]

My precious, oh my precious is back. Off to dream sweet visions of Lost returned. Great episode! Can't wait to rewatch it!

[perrticle]

They said - not exactly in portland - which to me might be hinting at alternate-dimention/space-time disturbances or something along those lines.. or it could be quite literal, an island near Portland.

[RoseArienh]

Oh yes! That's the Lost I've been waiting for!

And that bus! I think I got whiplash.

[Dagolu]

near? south pacific just off fiji is near portland?

[Fletcher]

That was a pretty awesome episode, not to mention emotional. Kate's retelling of Jack's "Pilot" story was really touching, as was the scene where Juliet found out her sister was pregnant. And Juliet is a prisoner on the island, just like Jack? How is that possible? And why did they need Jack in particular to perform the surgery?

LOST is back!! Wahoo!

[LPU]

It was a very good episode. Same problems as I Do though, too much expected going in/coming out of the hiatus, and they were unable to deliver on that level. The two watched back to back will be very good however.

[Hawksrule]

http://www.mittelosbioscience.org/


can anyone check if it's real?

ok- WHOIS says this:
Admin Name:Richard Alpert
Admin Organization:Mittelos Bioscience
Admin Street1:108 Hofmann Blvd.
Admin City:Multnomah County
Admin State/Province:Oregon

Clearly a show tie-in. But how thorough can you get? geez!

[redneck once removed]

this episode is crazy. whoa! sister's pregnant now...wait, maybe her sisters kid is the one helping sawyer and kate get away...perhaps.

or Maybe it's Karl...

So, either Ben and Danielle did the dirty dance or Ben is the adopted (and not biological) father of Alex.

So the Boss is Alex's father. Does that mean it's Ben?? And so Ben and Rousseau were together??

not necessary, Ben might have been Alex's father figure since they kidnapped her as an infant, but I don't think he is her biological father.

I agree. He may have made Alex think he's her father, but if he really was, I am sure Danielle would've recognized him when she had him in the net...

Possibly to show that, even though they deny it, they plant seeds of knowledge with her that they really can arrange anything.

I'm sure theres a paralell to the 'we cause our own suffering' screen in the mind control film. maybe they want us to believe juliet partly caused the bus thing

[Richie]

Lost is finally back! I was beginning to lose hope from the five episodes that aired during the Fall.

This episode kinda disappointed me at first. While the beginning was good - I was afraid that we were just going to get the same thing we've been getting. "Filler" flashbacks that are more annoying then helpful. That seemed to be the case with this episode, but then the last flash back summed it up and blew me away. That's how Lost should be and wasn't during the Fall episodes. Plus, the lack of romance was a major breath of fresh air.

We're in for a good season, fellows. :Cheers:

[dreamfall]

I don't think Karl or anyone over the age of 4 could be Juliet's sister's kid. At the end, Juliet says she's been on the island for 3 years, and at the end of the flashback she was just about to accept the job with them.

[SonOfSawyer]

I'm sure theres a paralell to the 'we cause our own suffering' screen in the mind control film. maybe they want us to believe juliet partly caused the bus thing

very good point, how can anyone organize a bus accident like this one?

[xpButtercup]

GOOSEBUMPS!!

Can't wait til hubby watches this tomorrow so we can talk about it!
:D

[Homer Noodleman]

Oh my. Good episode -- they should have ended the mini-season with that one instead of that farcical cliffhanger. The layers of seperation at the end... Kate from Jack, her step-sister from Karl, Juliet from her sister, and add to that pairings that may or may not matter... Kate and Sawyer, Jack and Juliet, Alex and Ben. Live together, die alone all twisted up in one ending scene. Very nicely done.

"God loves you like He loved Jacob." Jacob talked about in the past tense? So, who was the Jacob that made the list? A Yemi-like apparition? Very strange.

Juliet's dosier was interesting in light of the information we know has been likely gathered about the castaways. For two and a third season I've tried to ferret out manipoulation in the backstories of the castways, now we're shown manipulation in Juliet's backstory.

Juliet didn't crash on the island, she was transported there. I think the notion that the plane had intentionally turned towards the island has some more legs. They werre going to land that plane somewhere and get whoever it was they were interested in onto the island. Hmmm...

Fertility, premature aging, dead leaders drawing up lists?

It was good to see Kate back in form. The scene where she takes the rifle and is ready to blow the guard's knee to smithereens was Kate at her enigmatic best.

I seem to recall some redshirts that occassionally appear in the show. A fatr guy, a bald guy, a blonde ditz, and so forth. Wonder what has become of them?

[twilightsun]

I'll be back in the morning to read more of this thread... I must go to bed now. But here's a link to my thoughts on the episode (http://unchartedisland.wildeggplant.com/2007/02/07/not-in-portland-lost-comes-back-with-a-bang/). I tried to blog as I watched, and that didn't leave much time for seeing what everyone else thought. It should be interesting to see how in sync or out of tune I was with everyone else...

[Hawksrule]

"Jacob" has to be "him". That image in the video said something along the lines of "God loves you, as he loves Jacob". Now: who in the blue blazes is Jacob?

Jacob was a major character in the Old Testament. His birth was a gift to God to Isaac, when Isaac's wife was TOO OLD TO HAVE CHILDREN. More here- http://demo.lutherproductions.com/bibletutor/level1/program/start/people/jacob.htm

[treygar]

can anyone say where Ethan and Juliet passed each other in the first scene...was it in the hotel room hallway or something like that?

[Homer Noodleman]

Oops. Double post

[djsunyc]

mittelos bioscience

is mittelos the anagram?

mittelos = lost time

[truffula]

Some first round viewing notes:

- What an AMAZING shot to open the episode after 13 weeks. The folks in the Cinematography Dept get an A++ from me for this episode just for giving us this shot :)

- 4cc's in the needle Juliet gave her sister in the first FB

- as soon as I saw Ethan, I said to myself "holy crap, they are gonna confirm Off Island Hanso/Dharma agents tonight!!" :hyper: (and they did too)

- I was :rotfl: at Sawyer deliberately hitting Pickett's head 3 times into the food button so he would get shocked :p

- as soon as Juliet's Ex said he wanted in, I knew whatever it was she was doing was gonna be the reason that Hanso/Dharma was lookin into her.

- "you have 3 minutes" Jack says to Juliet - just like Miss Klugh said to Michael about Walt last season. :)

- MittelosBioscience, privately funded - BY THE HANSO FOUNDATION (don't forget to say that part :p)

BTW - THERE IS A WEBSITE FOR MITTELOSBIOSCIENCE - IT IS A CONFIRMED FANSITE.

- What was the book that the Hydra guard was reading? It was "A Brief Story of...." and I couldn't see the last word.

- WOOKIE PRISONER GAG!!!! OMG!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! That was PRICELESS!!! :rotfl:

- Karl is held in Room 23 - THE NUMBERS ARE BACK :D

- the only thing that I saw that flashed in that crazy video (that I was so toughly hoping was gonna be a TLE tie-in, but oh well :p) was something like "He loves you like God loved Jacob." The only reason it stood out was the JACOB reference. That and a few frames after, we see none other than Gerald DeGroot (in the same shot he's seen in the Swan Orientation film).

- I'm sorry, but YAY!!! Pickett is dead!!! :yayconfet That guy was a real jerk.

- As Jack "fixed" Ben, the number seen on his cart (blood pressure or something, I don't know) was 108 then it changed to something else real fast. I'll have a cap of it later ;)

- I thought that was an amazing tie in of Jack's story about the girl's surgery he messed up and fixed paralleling what he was doing with Ben. Very well shot. Ver cool concept. Good one, TPTB :)

- 3 years, 2 months, 28 days has Juliet been on the Island. Now who wants to tell me what day she arrived? ;)

- Again I say, the confirmation that HANSO/DHARMA has "Off-Island" recruitment was the biggest part of this episode for me. It explains how Kelvin got there for one, and also puts ALOT of backing behind ALVAR HANSO and his Hanso Foundation running the whole show. Ben, Jacob?, whoever....at the top of the chain is ONE MAN. And I firmly believe that ONE MAN is none other than ALVAR HANSO. :D


Caps coming tomorrow (or late tonight if I can get to it ;))

I'd also like to take a quick second to tell y'all about THE LOST TRUFFULA - if you like reading my notes and checkin out the caps I post, I have created a blog where I will be housing all my Episode notes and caps - http://thelosttruffula.blogspot.com - its exactly what I post here (and I post em here first of course :)) but its all in one place and not buried in a 600+ reply thread :p

Enjoy!

Peace,
Truff

[redneck once removed]

Jacob was a major character in the Old Testament. His birth was a gift to God to Isaac, when Isaac's wife was TOO OLD TO HAVE CHILDREN. More here- http://demo.lutherproductions.com/bibletutor/level1/program/start/people/jacob.htm

Random thought - Rachel (Juliet's sister's name) was one of Jacob's wives in the bible who couldn't have kids. She was sterile.

[vonnegut]

I don't think Karl or anyone over the age of 4 could be Juliet's sister's kid. At the end, Juliet says she's been on the island for 3 years, and at the end of the flashback she was just about to accept the job with them.

Unless time passes slower on the island....

(just kidding)


Just here to chip in my little two cents...



BEN LIVES!!!!!!!!!!!

:Cheers:


So excited about that.

What a great episode...

Being hit by the bus... brilliant. How creepy.

Interesting that Juliet is a prisoner there, if she's not lying... also makes me harken back to Ben telling Jack "I will take you [back to civilization]." I wonder if Ben just told Juliet that he would take her with them... Hmmm. All depends on how much the past history of lying tells us about all this.


Ben lives.

Ben lives.




I'm so, so happy.

[The Life of Riley]

"God loves you like He loved Jacob." Jacob talked about in the past tense? So, who was the Jacob that made the list? A Yemi-like apparition? Very strange.

Hmm, I didn't catch that it was past tense. That's interesting.

Juliet didn't crash on the island, she was transported there. I think the notion that the plane had intentionally turned towards the island has some more legs. They werre going to land that plane somewhere and get whoever it was they were interested in onto the island. Hmmm...

Especially if they also caused the bus crash.

[GerfalconCP]

wait .. what is the exact date on the island? someone told me that the date is really important because of how long she said she has been on the island ... 3 years, 2 months, and 28 days ... if it's been around 72 days (correct me if i'm wrong) then it's .... around December 6th? so, minus three years (2001), 2 months (back to October 6th, 2001 now), minus 28 days ... isn't that really close to September 11th? Is that important? or just coincidence? it would make the actual date since she got on the island ... September 8th, I believe ... but I could be wrong with December 6th ... maybe it's December 3rd? I'm SOOOO confused!

[Hawksrule]

The Ludovico technique uses a combination of violent images and nausea to make people sick of doing bad things. Would a combination of good images and nausea make a person sick of doing good?

This could be a simpler re-programming, a la Flash Gordon. Of course, it didnt work on Flash ;-)

[AceOfDiamonds]

I'd like to second Homer's suspicion that Oceanic Flight 815 was originally intended to land as opposed to crash on our mysterious Craphole island; and that the only thing the Others didn't expect was Desmond happening to not push the button, which in turn led to the unexpected crash as opposed to an expected landing.

That would explain why Ben was so desperate from the very beginning for Ethan and Goodwin to find survivors (if Ben wanted Jack there, for example, to cover his surgery, the idea of Jack being dead before the operation could take place must have been a frightening thought for him.)

It ALSO explains why the Others would be more hostile to the Oceanic survivors than they maybe originally intended. After all, had the plane landed as intended, perhaps the Others could have brainwashed the Losties into submission. That would have prevented the necessity of coercion in order to get Jack and company to play by the Other's rules.

[turnip head]

Wow, that was good. I have to watch again I tried to slo mo for the bus but didn't get much out of it. The casting department for Lost must really like the HBO series OZ. Maybe they had to let Michael and Eko go so they could hire the very sleezy Governor Devlin to play Juliette's ex.

[Lostitute]

- What was the book that the Hydra guard was reading? It was "A Brief Story of...." and I couldn't see the last word.

"A Brief History of Time" by Stephen Hawking.

[SimonO]

Jacob was a major character in the Old Testament. His birth was a gift to God to Isaac, when Isaac's wife was TOO OLD TO HAVE CHILDREN. More here- http://demo.lutherproductions.com/bibletutor/level1/program/start/people/jacob.htm
I am well aware of the story of Jacob. This is, however, Lost. Jacob is an apparently major player in "The others", so I personally believe the quote is, at the very least, double entendre.

[Homer Noodleman]

Forgot to mention. Bird whacking into window, bus whacking into Ex? I wonder...

[salem2005]

wait .. what is the exact date on the island? someone told me that the date is really important because of how long she said she has been on the island ... 3 years, 2 months, and 28 days ... if it's been around 72 days (correct me if i'm wrong) then it's .... around December 6th? so, minus three years (2001), 2 months (back to October 6th, 2001 now), minus 28 days ... isn't that really close to September 11th? Is that important? or just coincidence? it would make the actual date since she got on the island ... September 8th, I believe ... but I could be wrong with December 6th ... maybe it's December 3rd? I'm SOOOO confused!

I'm too tired to figure out the date...but I read somewhere before this episode that it is supposed to work out to 9/11/2001. Not sure where they are going with this...why they would make it that terrible date in America's history.

[Dagolu]

wow the others are pretty academic a brief history of time is one of the most difficult books to understand... is that another result of the ludovico technique? enhanced brainpower?

[Liz-trouve-verlorene]

- What was the book that the Hydra guard was reading? It was "A Brief Story of...." and I couldn't see the last word.

- the only thing that I saw that flashed in that crazy video (that I was so toughly hoping was gonna be a TLE tie-in, but oh well :p) was something like "He loves you like God loved Jacob." The only reason it stood out was the JACOB reference. That and a few frames after, we see none other than Gerald DeGroot (in the same shot he's seen in the Swan Orientation film).



"A Brief History of Time" was the book that the Hydra guard was reading.

Also, in the mind-control video it said, "God loves you like he loved Jacob" and also "You are the cause of your own suffering" is one more I can recall.

I KNEW there were Hanso/Dharma agents working off-island! Kelvin himself had said he was a Dharma spook for 10 years!

This was an amazing episode, finally some solid answers!

[SonOfSawyer]

wait .. what is the exact date on the island? someone told me that the date is really important because of how long she said she has been on the island ... 3 years, 2 months, and 28 days ... if it's been around 72 days (correct me if i'm wrong) then it's .... around December 6th? so, minus three years (2001), 2 months (back to October 6th, 2001 now), minus 28 days ... isn't that really close to September 11th? Is that important? or just coincidence? it would make the actual date since she got on the island ... September 8th, I believe ... but I could be wrong with December 6th ... maybe it's December 3rd? I'm SOOOO confused!

according to Lostpedia

I do was December 3, 2004 (day 73)

http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Timeline
(http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Timeline:December_2004)

[turnip head]

Some first round viewing notes:

[- What was the book that the Hydra guard was reading? It was "A Brief Story of...." and I couldn't see the last word.

-Enjoy!

Peace,
Truff

The book was a A Brief History of Time
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A Brief History of Time is a popular science book written by Professor Stephen Hawking and first published in 1988. It rapidly became a best-seller, and had sold 9 million copies by 2002. It was also on the London Sunday Times best-seller list for 237 weeks.[1]
Contents

It attempts to explain a range of subjects in cosmology, including the Big Bang, black holes, light cones and superstring theory, to the nonspecialist reader. Its main goal is to give an overview of the subject but, unusually for a popular science book, it also attempts to explain some complex mathematics.
The author notes that an editor warned him that for every equation in the book the readership will be halved, hence it includes only a single equation: E=mc².
In addition to Hawking's abstinence from equations, the book also simplifies matters by means of illustrations throughout the text, depicting complex models and diagrams.
The book is considered by many to be an "unread bestseller" [1] which is a book many people own but few have finished.
There is also a documentary by the same name, directed by Errol Morris, released in 1991.

[DharmaUdonNoodles]

Whereas it is probably true that the time she has been on the island is the same as the time she has "worked" for them, it should also be mentioned that she could have been working for them for years at some other area before being imprisoned on the island. I say this only as a possibility that Carl could be Rachel's kid. But they weren't keen on having Rachel around while she was having therapy, but maybe they took her kid after she gave birth.

[Loveriot]

Mittelos is an anagram for time lost. and in entertainment weekly they said an anagram will be in tonights series that underlines the mythology. and this will point to the two skeletons. my theory? the two skeletons are two of our lost crew and time is lost on this island (more on this concept on entertainment weekly)

Where can I found out more about this? This sounds great.

[Dagolu]

whose womb is 70+ years old in lost? Jack's wife perhaps?

[truffula]

"A Brief History of Time" by Stephen Hawking.
Thank you! :)

I would also like to agree with Homer's statement that the plane was likely steered towards the Island deliberately, and was supposed to land, but Desmond failing to push the button screwed it all up a little.

And with the confirmation of "Off Island Agents" does that not make y'all think that at least SOME of the passengers of Flight 815 were "coerced" onto the flight? I think specifically of Richard Malkin, Claire's "psychic" who claimed to be a fraud to Mr. Eko in a FB. Whoever it was that was going to adopt Claire's baby in LA were likely HANSO/DHARMA agents. Remember, Ethan went after Claire BEFORE he had his LIST. He KNEW they wanted HER in specific already.

[GerfalconCP]

I wonder whose womb that was they showed Juliet during her interview - Colleen's maybe?



I was thinking that since it was supposed to look like it came from an old woman but it came from a 27 year old, maybe ... MAYBE it is somehow Rousseau's? Maybe Rousseau was so like Walt in that she wouldn't take to the brainwashing that they instead let her go and told her to never bother them again? But, before they let her go, they took her child ... we all think that time might slow down on the island, so maybe she looks older on the outside but her innards stay younger, thus saying she's 27? I don't know ... I'm confused!

[stephew]

Where can I found out more about this? This sounds great.

here ya go
http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20010504,00.html

[treygar]

Thank you! :)

I would also like to agree with Homer's statement that the plane was likely steered towards the Island deliberately, and was supposed to land, but Desmond failing to push the button screwed it all up a little.

And with the confirmation of "Off Island Agents" does that not make y'all think that at least SOME of the passengers of Flight 815 were "coerced" onto the flight? I think specifically of Richard Malkin, Claire's "psychic" who claimed to be a fraud to Mr. Eko in a FB. Whoever it was that was going to adopt Claire's baby in LA were likely HANSO/DHARMA agents. Remember, Ethan went after Claire BEFORE he had his LIST. He KNEW they wanted HER in specific already.


um...if the plane was expected to land how come instead of preparing for the flight to land the Others were eating muffins and reading Stephen King books at the time the plane came into the islands area?

[RoseArienh]

I just did a search for "You are the cause of your own suffering" and got this page: Scriptural references for I Am the Good Shepherd (http://awake.seranates.com/aug/aug22ref.htm). I have no idea of the affiliation or purpose of this site, but it was interesting.

[Homer Noodleman]

Truff,

Michael/Walt, Claire/Aaron, Kate and I suppose Sawyer are the castaways that had tickets bought for them and were placed on that flight.

treygar,

It was landing at the base that the resupply flights come from.

[Without Dane]

That was really good. Some solid confirmation of some suspected ideas (off-island agents, why the Others want kids). Otherwise, surprisingly little to contemplate. Good thing its back next week!

[vonnegut]

um...if the plane was expected to land how come instead of preparing for the flight to land the Others were eating muffins and reading Stephen King books at the time the plane came into the islands area?

Well...

We didn't see Tom or Danny in that scene did we?

Much like we didn't see Juliet tramping around in the jungle in Season 1 or 2.

It seemed like it was the intellectual Science crew, so to speak, that were eating muffins.

The ones actually receiving the plane could have been preparing.

That's why everyone was shocked when they saw the plane breaking up... but no one seemed really surprised to see the plane itself.


The more I think about it, the more I feel like this fits in with Ben's reaction in that episode.

[oldwoman]

Juliet's sister is the same women who played Calamity Jane on Deadwood.
Yes.........Robin Weigert...played Clamity Jane.....
and this makes the third woman from Deadwood to appear in Lost.
We saw Joanie Tubbs in one episode.............and Trixie was
in two episodes.
I love Deadwood.

[Hawksrule]

Is Juliet more assertive on the island? Or does she just pretend and lie better than she did in Miami? One could argue that she's always having her strings pulled, her destiny controlled, by some man - her ex-husband, then Mittelos' agent, and later Ben.

Was Tom really befriending Jack? Or is he just trying to gain his trust? It seems all the Others are aware of the need to have leverage. I think Ben might have told Juliet to "act like you're helping Sawyer and Kate" in the knowledge that they might escape on their own. Whether she actually ended up helping or not, she would've claimed that she had.

Another funny thing about Jacob in the Bible (LOST has a lot of religious stuff, after all). Jacob was an interesting character because he was willing to do ANYthing to get God's blessing. He stole his brother's birthright, and tricked his dying father into blessing him instead of his brother. This sounds like Dharma- they're doing whatever it takes to bring about a greater good.

At least they didn't named the episode "Not in Kansas". But I wonder if we'll see a Mittelos office in Multnomah County Oregon in a future episode? Certainly a lot of things to read into the title.

[melancana]

GREAT episode. I wish this one had been the fall finale, it makes much more sense as the end of a miniseries like TPTB claimed the fall season was. Loved the parallelism with the Pilot - Jack telling Kate the story as she stiches up his back; Kate telling Jack the story as he works on Ben's back.

So now that Jack knows that Juliet is trapped with the Others just like he is... I predict they will join forces and become allies.

[treygar]

treygar,

It was landing at the base that the resupply flights come from.


yeah i just don't see it, sorry. plus, Ben said that the arrival of Jack crashing into the island was like a message from God or whatever, that he didn't expect it. if they expected Jack he wouldn't have acted like that.

i really think this episode has people thinking way more outside the box than necessary.

this was a Juliet episode and it only to me showed that Juliet and perhaps a few other Others were duped or forced or coerced onto the island, Juliet probably realized that if Dharma/Hanso could kill her ex with a bus then imagine what they would do to her sister.

real simple really. everything else we are talking on is speculation that can be monkeywrenched by events we'll see next week.

[vonnegut]

yeah i just don't see it, sorry. plus, Ben said that the arrival of Jack crashing into the island was like a message from God or whatever, that he didn't expect it. if they expected Jack he wouldn't have acted like that.


Ben is a liar and a manipulator. Take anything he says with a grain of salt... especially when he so clearly wants something.


i really think this episode has people thinking way more outside the box than necessary.


Wait until T&S gets hoppin.... :D

And yung said that "Apollo" was on the side of the bus. If this is true, he will be absolutely unbearable.


this was a Juliet episode and it only to me showed that Juliet and perhaps a few other Others were duped or forced or coerced onto the island, Juliet probably realized that if Dharma/Hanso could kill her ex with a bus then imagine what they would do to her sister.

real simple really. everything else we are talking on is speculation that can be monkeywrenched by events we'll see next week.

But speculating is fun....

[truffula]

um...if the plane was expected to land how come instead of preparing for the flight to land the Others were eating muffins and reading Stephen King books at the time the plane came into the islands area?
Vonne said it pretty well, that was more like the scientific research community part of Dharma, they don't know the first thing about landing planes and such. But it sure helps explain why almost as soon as he came out of his house after the tremors (in S3E1) that Ben looked immediately skyward - they were expecting a plane (they don't see too many of them there I imagine, so a plane, even if not crashing would be a sight).


Truff,

Michael/Walt, Claire/Aaron, Kate and I suppose Sawyer are the castaways that had tickets bought for them and were placed on that flight.
Thanks, Homer!! :) I am gonna be workin on a new theory because of some of the stuff we learned tonight, and that info is very helpful! :)

[Dagolu]

I can really see jack going evil and becoming an other throug the ludovico technique... it would really make his character much more interesting on island

[Amelia Earhart]

[ quote=Mr. Doug;1298681]"Wookie Prisoner Gag"[/quote]

Sawyer's Star Wars reference was classic. Kate should nickname Sawyer Chewy. :bear:

[LostEmissary]

Lots to process in that episode! We're starting to get a clearer picture of what "the Others" are up to, or at least how they operate. I'll have to watch this one again to let it sink in.

Wookie prisoner gag was hilarious. :D

[truffula]

Wait until T&S gets hoppin.... :D

And yung said that "Apollo" was on the side of the bus. If this is true, he will be absolutely unbearable.

I agree on both counts ;)

I can confirm that APOLLO was on the side of the bus. APOLLO CANDY that is :p A while back there was a spoiler pic of it that I saved cause it was TLE tie-in in the smallest of small ways - yes, we saw the Apollo bars in the Hatch first, but I have two of them in my fridge, so :D. I can retrieve the pic if you like. :) I know I have it somewhere ;)

[oldwoman]

What did Sawyer think while seeing those messages? Is he thinking that he needs to stop running from the good things in his life?




I was wondering the very same thing........cause it sure looked
like Sawyer was really thinking hard about what he was seeing
on the screen in that room. :)

[Liz-trouve-verlorene]

wasn't it absolutely wild when Ben started talking while Jack and Tom thought he was still under anesthesia?!? and then he calmly says, "Oh, I've heard you for the past few minutes...."

[Dagolu]

how long do you plan on keeping those chocolate bars truff?

[Liz-trouve-verlorene]

I agree on both counts ;)

I can confirm that APOLLO was on the side of the bus. APOLLO CANDY that is :p A while back there was a spoiler pic of it that I saved cause it was TLE tie-in in the smallest of small ways - yes, we saw the Apollo bars in the Hatch first, but I have two of them in my fridge, so :D. I can retrieve the pic if you like. :) I know I have it somewhere ;)

Yung already has the Apollo bus pic up on his Homoplasmates thread!:)

[Brian]

I can confirm that APOLLO was on the side of the bus. APOLLO CANDY that is :p A while back there was a spoiler pic of it that I saved cause it was TLE tie-in in the smallest of small ways - yes, we saw the Apollo bars in the Hatch first, but I have two of them in my fridge, so :D. I can retrieve the pic if you like. :) I know I have it somewhere ;)

There's a pic in the Quick Question Thread.

ETA - Here's the link (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hawaii/278625069/in/set-72157594343632550/)

[Chinamom]

S3E5 “NOT IN PORTLAND”

BIG QUESTIONS:
Juliet: “Are you afraid he’ll find out?” Who is HE?
Who is Mr. Albert? Related to Alvar?
Did Mr. Albert orchestrate Edmund’s death?
How did he know Rachel was pregnant?

QUESTIONS ANSWERED:
BEN IS ALEX’S DAD?!?!
Well, almost. Jack: “Why didn’t you take him to a facility?” Tom: Ever since the sky turned purple we…” WHAT?! WE WHAT?

QUESTIONS SOMEONE SHOULD HAVE ASKED:
Actually, Jack asked 2 good questions: Why didn’t they take Ben off-island, and what did Ben say to Juliet. Thanks Jack.

BEHIND THE EP TITLE:
LOL! The island is definitely not in Portland!

SUSPENSION OF DISBELIEF:
That 3 Others with rifles would miss Kate, Sawyer, and Alex running ahead of them. But good thing they missed!

PARALLEL LINES/SCENES:
Juliet getting scolded by Edmund/getting scolded by Ben
Sun and Kate share the results of a positive pregnancy test/Juliet and Rachel share the results of a positive pregnancy test (no Widmore Lab on Rachel’s though)

POP CULTURE REFERENCES:
Missed the book title Aldo was reading

LOST COLORS:
All of Ben’s blood, bright red.

LOST LOCATIONS:
Miami
Portland

NICKNAMES:
Sheena, Underdog, Lollipop (Alex)
Cheech (Karl)

NUMBERS:
Door 5 at Juliet’s medical research facility
2:00 appointment with Dr. Albert
Small island is 2 miles from main island
Ben’s 3 minutes alone with Juliet and 27 minutes left to live
Juliet guessed the womb scans belonged to a woman in her 70’s
The actual woman was 26
23 Karl’s room number
Jack counting to 5
Juliet can have a 6 month trial period with Mittelos
Juliet on the island for 3 years, 2 months, 28 days

FAVORITE LINES/SCENES:
Sawyer shoving Danny’s head into the fish cracker button!!!
Edmund talking to his mom, “You’re insufferable and mean” LOL!

GREAT CINEMATOGRAPHY:
Juliet at beach in opening scene
Juliet and Mr. Albert in front of screen—I thought their shadows made them look like Darth Vaders though!
Kate and Sawyer rowing away

SERIOUSLY CREEPY:
Plane flying low over Miami outside Rachel’s window
Ben waking up during surgery!
Ethan…need I say more?
Karl’s brainwashing, YIKES: Everything changes. Plant a good seed. We are suffering causes of our own…? God loves you as He loved Jacob. Think about your life.
Edmund being hit by a bus!

MINOR QUESTIONS:
Is Edmund calling her JULIA instead of Juliet?
Significance of Mittelos bioscience? (a Greek god’s name?)
Did anyone else see Edmund’s body bag breathing? JUST KIDDING!
Where do I know Edmund from?

JUST CAN’T WRAP MY HEAD AROUND THIS:
If Juliet meant that Ben is Alex’s father, then if he was born on the island, how could he have fathered Alex with Danielle?

CHARACTERS

Jack: Still like him. A lot. Except when he offered Ben pain medication!

Kate: What a woman! Throws a great punch, will shoot a guy in the knee, and can sail an outrigger!

Sawyer: Whew, it was such a relief not to see him getting tortured and beaten again.

Sayid: Please, oh please, am I going to see him again someday?

Ben: I still think he’s very disturbed!

Juliet: OK, so she’s not really a true Other, in the born-on-the-island sense.

Vincent: I say Vincent will play a big part in saving the day!

SUMMARY:
WHOA! Action, surprises, new mysteries! I liked it :)

[Dagolu]

wasn't it absolutely wild when Ben started talking while Jack and Tom thought he was still under anesthesia?!? and then he calmly says, "Oh, I've heard you for the past few minutes...."

that is quite accurate. I know anathesia quite well and once you start to come out of it, you hear what other people are saying for a bit, go under for a bit, open your eyes but aren't fully aware, sleep for another minute and finally go conscious enough to speak... albeit garbled.

[Homer Noodleman]

treygar,

I've argued the Others are trapped on that Island just as much as the castaways are. Who ever controls the base the resupply flights come from -- the entry and exit point of the island (steer 325 to get there) -- are the one's who control the situation. Skip a couple of supply flights and Ben and company will do as told. Free-will for them, much less power, is a facade.

Truff, brush up on the Inverse Problem a bit. ;)

[oldwoman]

So, either Ben and Danielle did the dirty dance or Ben is the adopted (and not biological) father of Alex.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

That confused me also.
We have thought that Danille was Alex's mother. NOW...we are told
BEN....is the father ??? Can't wait to find out the story on this .:)

[Liz-trouve-verlorene]

POP CULTURE REFERENCES:
Missed the book title Aldo was reading

Significance of Mittelos bioscience? (a Greek god’s name?)


The book: "A Brief History of Time"

Signif. of Mittelos: an anagram of Lost Time? (per D & C hint in EW article of an anagram)

[SimonO]

Everyone's assuming Mittelos is the source of the reported anagram. Is there any reason for that?

[LostEmissary]

PARALLEL LINES/SCENES:
Juliet getting scolded by Edmund/getting scolded by Ben
Sun and Kate share the results of a positive pregnancy test/Juliet and Rachel share the results of a positive pregnancy test (no Widmore Lab on Rachel’s though)
Also: Michael was granted 3 minutes with Walt (in the episode "3 minutes"), Ben wanted "3 minutes" with Juilet.

[Dagolu]

because otherwise it would have been widmore, paik, hanso, mittlewerk or other

[PhishCake]

Anyone ever seen the show on Fx "It's always Sunny in Philadelphia"



What's his name!!!!!!

[The Life of Riley]

S3E5 “NOT IN PORTLAND”

QUESTIONS ANSWERED:
BEN IS ALEX’S DAD?!?!
Well, almost. Jack: “Why didn’t you take him to a facility?” Tom: Ever since the sky turned purple we…” WHAT?! WE WHAT?

Yea, that's the 2nd time that has been brought up, and still no clear answers. Apparently there were more consequences than we were aware of. Also, since it was implied that they couldn't take him to a facility because of effects of the sky turning purple, what does that mean for Michael and Walt trying to leave the island? (assuming Ben was telling the truth)

MINOR QUESTIONS:
Is Edmund calling her JULIA instead of Juliet?

Hmm, I didn't catch that, but Tom referred to her as "Julie."


JUST CAN’T WRAP MY HEAD AROUND THIS:
If Juliet meant that Ben is Alex’s father, then if he was born on the island, how could he have fathered Alex with Danielle?

Perhaps adopted father. Or he was lying about never having left the island.

Great recap Chinamom! :Cheers:

[Bugsy]

I'm too tired to figure out the date...but I read somewhere before this episode that it is supposed to work out to 9/11/2001. Not sure where they are going with this...why they would make it that terrible date in America's history.

I think it is only to let us know that she arrived via a military flight. Commercial flights were grounded after 9/11, so the only way out of the US would have been via military transport.


i really think this episode has people thinking way more outside the box than necessary.


Same here. I think the crash was not planned.

[Liz-trouve-verlorene]

Everyone's assuming Mittelos is the source of the reported anagram. Is there any reason for that?


...because lost time is a recurring theme? (many of the backstories look as if there is a blending of time periods...)

[SonOfSawyer]

JUST CAN’T WRAP MY HEAD AROUND THIS:
If Juliet meant that Ben is Alex’s father, then if he was born on the island, how could he have fathered Alex with Danielle?


maybe Juliet doesn't know about Danielle, and Alex being kidnapped. This proves that Alex think Ben is her real father, I wonder who she thinks mommy is

[Hawksrule]

Here's an Edmund Burke quote for you, from "Reflections on the Revolution in France":

"In my course I have known, and, according to my measure, have co-operated with great men; and I have never yet seen any plan which has not been mended by the observations of those who were much inferior in understanding to the person who took the lead in the business."

[oldwoman]

Where do I know Edmund from?

The actor has done a LOT of character work.
I saw him first as the governor in OZ.
He has also appeared on a few Law and Orders and other
dramas...........often plays a sleezy lawyer type.

[Evilrabbit]

I actually really enjoyed tonight’s recap special. I liked how the producers talked about stuff that was actually important to the show and the characters, and they actually know what they’re talking about most of the time, and they made some funny jokes, instead of random clips and weird narration that has nothing to do with anything like the other recaps. Kind of weird that they didn’t even so much as mention Walt, Michael, Boone, Shannon, Libby, or AnaLucia, and they barely mentioned Eko, not that that matters now. Totally looking forward to Not in Portland, I’ve stayed away from video spoilers, but I’ve heard great things. Hope the first Other-centric episode sheds some serious light.

What was the deal with Juliet and her sister, who seems to be a cancer patient? Is he injecting her with some experimental drug that hasn’t been approved yet? Who is she worried will find out? Benry? And why was Ethan there? Kate and Sawyer kicked Pickett’s ass Skinner box style! Does Juliet really not want Kate and Sawyer to escape or is she just covering?

I really admire Juliet’s calm in this situation, seeing as how her cover’s just been blown. Why is she so sure Jack won’t let Ben die? Is this based on personal experience? Her not letting her sister die? And what was with Dr. Edmund’s girlfriend? Is he not supposed to be with her? Ben waking up was a huge shocker. Did something go wrong with the anaesthesia, or is there something “special” about Ben that makes him “immune”? And is he aware what’s happening? Why does he want Juliet?

What kind of research is Juliet doing? DNA models on screen…genetic/cancer stuff? And what was with that appointment she made at the beginning of the episode? What kind of history do Ben and Juliet have? The obvious answer is that they were married/ romantically involved, but it’d be a cool twist if they turned out to be brother/sister or something. First Alex says Karl is dead, then he’s alive but held prisoner? Why the change? Is she making all this up, and she really is loyal to the Others but has been hiding it well?

That room was the weirdest/creepiest thing on Lost ever? What are they trying to brainwash him to do? Gotta look at screencaps of that again. “Plant a good seed?” Shudder! So Dr. Burke is Juliet’s ex-husband, and that’s why she doesn’t want to work with him. Is it the same situation with Ben? I soooo wanna hear what Ben + Juliet said to each other when Jack left the room. What’s so special about the research center outside Portland? Are they funded by Hanso, and that’s how Juliet starts working for Dharma? And hang on just one second…pregnant male rats???

So Juliet was helping her sister get pregnant. Does this have something to do with Jin and Sun’s baby, or the similar serum that Ethan injected into Claire’s belly? And Alex is Ben’s daughter? I assume this means in the adopted, non-biological sense, unless Danielle knew Ben before she came to the island – unlikely. I knew about Juliet shooting Pickett and that dude getting hit by a bus beforehand, still big shockers.

So Juliet’s a prisoner on the island, and was apparently recruited under false pretences, and can’t even leave to see her niece/nephew! So sad! I like how they make us realise her role as a victim in all this after all this time of her dominating Jack, unsure if she is sympathetic or not. It's kind of ironic that even though she was holding Jack captive, she's actually just as much a prisoner as he is. And we all thought she wanted Ben dead so she could gain status, but all she really wanted was her freedom. Is that what Tom meant by “history” or is there something else. Now I see why the episode title was “Not in Portland”, because they were actually recruiting her to go directly to the island. I assume they were spying on her, since Ethan was in her sister’s building and they knew about the pregnancy. And they arranged to have her ex-husband run over by a bus. Also, since they were so interested in a fertility doctor’s work, we know the Dharma initiative is very strongly concerned with babies, as we saw with the whole Claire abduction thing. I absolutely LOVED how the story of Jack’s first solo operation paralleled what he was going through at the time, and helped him finish the operation, and had an emotional effect on Kate too. And it was so sad how Jack was willing to sacrifice himself to make sure Kate and Sawyer were able to escape, even though it broke his heart to see them together on the video screen. The scene between Alex and Karl was really sweet too. Overall, one of the best Lost episodes ever, and just what I needed to wash off the hiatus blues!

[LostEmissary]

QUESTIONS ANSWERED:
BEN IS ALEX’S DAD?!?!
Well, almost. Jack: “Why didn’t you take him to a facility?” Tom: Ever since the sky turned purple we…” WHAT?! WE WHAT?Perhaps they've lost contact with the outside world, or have been unable to leave the Island(s).

MINOR QUESTIONS:
Is Edmund calling her JULIA instead of Juliet?I think he called her Julie, which would make sense as being a shortened version of Juliet.

JUST CAN’T WRAP MY HEAD AROUND THIS:
If Juliet meant that Ben is Alex’s father, then if he was born on the island, how could he have fathered Alex with Danielle?I'm guessing he's not her biological father. Likely he's her "adoptive" father, and Alex doesn't know who her biological parents are.

CHARACTERS

Jack: Still like him. A lot. Except when he offered Ben pain medication!Me too.

[djsunyc]

well it looks like people grow FASTER on the island...like dog years. for every year that goes by, you age 3 years or so. so a 26 year old woman's insides look like a 70 year old's. maybe that's why vincent is on the show as a major clue - to give a hint of dog years or something like that.

[LostEmissary]

Kind of weird that they didn’t even so much as mention Walt, Michael, Boone, Shannon, Libby, or AnaLucia, and they barely mentioned Eko, not that that matters now. Which is exactly why they didn't mention them. They basically only showed people that matter any more, and relevant parts of their story. I was wondering why at the beginning of the recap they'd go all the way back to the pilot where Kate is stitching up Jack, until I saw how it played into tonight's episode.

[professormariah]

Awesome episode!! I wonder if the Jacob that was on the list is the same one that is on the screen Karl was watching.